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pkumar 12/5/2012 | 1:20:11 AM
re: Stitt: Sonet's Even More Dead Major metro edge and access supplier are still upgrading the SONET ADM, XC with next generation SONET Gear that support ethernet, Fiberchannel and TDM traffic over SONET. The key technologies such as GFP-F/GFP-T, VC and LCAS extend the life of SONET. I do not see the SONET is Dead in near future.
mgillespie 12/5/2012 | 1:20:27 AM
re: Stitt: Sonet's Even More Dead The average zx gbic with a budget for 23Db- will push 70KM quite happily. As far as 100 if your fiber splicing is good.
However, the mechanism that companies are choosing to deliver long haul ethernet solutions like this depend entirely upon the company and the type of hardware they buy.
PO 12/5/2012 | 1:20:31 AM
re: Stitt: Sonet's Even More Dead ...if you want a circuit to possess a bandwidth greater than 3mb/s and budget over a 3 year period, ethernet is the defacto first choice for as far as 40KM with scope as high as 1Gig.

Can anyone fill me in on the technology stack being offered? 100BaseFX over SMF at 1310nm, point-to-point and unrepeatered? Something else?
mgillespie 12/5/2012 | 1:20:36 AM
re: Stitt: Sonet's Even More Dead dadofamunky, you're missing the bigger picture. This however, does not mean that A. the picture is not truly gigantic or B. You aren't standing within a 0.5 picometre distance of the picture.
At risk of sounding boring by repeating myself, SONET is not dead, nor is it's slightly more talented sibling SDH. However:

"Ethernet and IP Services are making inroads? Where?"

Hell yeah. If inroads means gaining market share. Then ethernet products are making inroads. Once upon a time if you wanted a WAN circuit of more than 45mb/s you had to use SONET or ATM over SONET regardless of distance. Now in the UK if you want a circuit to possess a bandwidth greater than 3mb/s and budget over a 3 year period, ethernet is the defacto first choice for as far as 40KM with scope as high as 1Gig. After that, and usually only then, does SDH really start making sense.

"What about Yipes?" You say! Not the most heart warming of business stories. However, don't overlook Bredbandsbolaget, Tiscali, and now even BT really flying the flag and making ethernet a cost affective alternative.

Ethernet is really really going forwards with all kinds of leaps and bounds. However it is not, will never be, and really is stupid to suggest. A 100% alternative to SDH/SONET. The day I see a Gbic transmitting data over seas, or even over more than 200KM in anything but a hypothetical scenario, without a piece of SDH to piggy back across. Is the day I eat that very gbic.

I only continue with this rant, agreeing with everything you've said because I fail to see what the argument is that is being perpetuated.

Ethernet and SONET (MPLS being an augmentation of either)are two totally different things with totally different purposes. There just happens to be a small area of crossover that is becoming further separated due to technology advancements. Developments are taking their natural course, and product offerings are exploiting the maturation of both.
Will one kill the other? On the same day that the common house cat becomes extinct because Freds' petshop sold more puppies during the christmas break.

end rant.
m.
douggreen 12/5/2012 | 1:20:42 AM
re: Stitt: Sonet's Even More Dead firstmile,

Thanks for the correction.

dadofamunky 12/5/2012 | 1:20:43 AM
re: Stitt: Sonet's Even More Dead Ethernet and IP Services are making inroads? Where? Remember Yipes? How about CoSine? They make a system that pretty much does everything but there has never been sufficient demand for it. Shasta? That's a Nortel giveaway. Is there a single company anywhere that is making serious money, profitable money, off IP services?

Maybe in 30 years MPLS/Eth. will be SONET's undoing. But reliability and performance are big issues with MPLS. No OA&M with MPLS. Sorry, but without that, MPLS probably will never break out of a niche market. So what if Cisco backs it? They also sell TDM gear.
firstmile 12/5/2012 | 1:20:44 AM
re: Stitt: Sonet's Even More Dead Doug,
The EFM 802.3ah standard was ratified in June '04. It is a done deal.
...first
opticalone 12/5/2012 | 1:20:46 AM
re: Stitt: Sonet's Even More Dead I don't know where you got your degree, Do The Math, but Wi-Fi is not a real substitution for cellular voice. Wi-Fi operates in unlicenced spectrum and is great for data, but most cellular demand remains voice only with only a small percentage used for data transfer (i.e. e-mail).

The real debate will come when WiMax gains commercial acceptance and you can reach several kilometers and be able to hand-off between Wi-Max antennaes.
douggreen 12/5/2012 | 1:20:46 AM
re: Stitt: Sonet's Even More Dead npuguy,

I believe that the only vendor that Iometrix has tested so far is Hatteras Networks. I also believe that the standard is in draft form (please correct me if I am wrong). A good start, but still a ways to go before it is fully baked by RBOC standards.

What this needs is a couple of good old fashioned nationwide CLECs to go out on a limb, push the envelope, and force the RBOCs to do something. Unfortunately, the founders of MFS are either retired or in the IXC business now :(
npuguy 12/5/2012 | 1:20:47 AM
re: Stitt: Sonet's Even More Dead signmeup,

[snip]
How do I put an ethernet port in remote loopback?
[snip]

The IEEE 802.3ah (EFM) standard includes OAM capability to put an ethernet port in remote loopback. I believe Iometrix is offering compliance testing in this area as well (I don't work there)

npuguy
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