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Oakster 12/4/2012 | 9:22:54 PM
re: Lighting Out From Telecom Town vapa writes...

Why are you dissing other fine Ivy League schools? Can you name all seven? Who can in this board?

Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Dartmouth, Columbia, Brown, Cornell, and UPenn.

By my count, that makes eight.

By the way, the Ivy League is officially just an athletic conference.
vapa 12/4/2012 | 9:22:54 PM
re: Lighting Out From Telecom Town We have imported so many average engineers from abroad at the peril of our own graduates. It is really a sad story when we see our graduates from Harvard, MIT, Stanford and Princeton are not able to find jobs while many companies, particularly in Caklifornia, continue to import foreign workers.

Why are you dissing other fine Ivy League schools? Can you name all seven? Who can in this board?
opticalPassion 12/4/2012 | 9:22:52 PM
re: Lighting Out From Telecom Town
I mean, is education important at all in this industry? You don't need a Master degree, not to mention a PhD, to be a good telecom software engineer. Of course, there are exceptions that work areas such as probibility/statistics (for ATM switch) and signal processing (DSP) etc. requires advanced knowledge, but to write a SONET/WDM switching software, a good high school kid is trainable for the job! (not to
insult anyone who are writing software, this is in fact the reality).

I have seen new grad who does a good job in writing software (it works), but is very poor in mathematics. Am i confused? Then who need those who have advanced educations?


achorale 12/4/2012 | 9:22:51 PM
re: Lighting Out From Telecom Town opticalPassion writes:

> but to write a SONET/WDM switching software,
> a good high school kid is trainable for the
> job! (not to insult anyone who are writing
> software, this is in fact the reality).

could you please identify which vendor you
work for so that i might avoid those products
in the future?

thanks ...

Tony Li 12/4/2012 | 9:22:51 PM
re: Lighting Out From Telecom Town

For what it's worth:

For the last decade, I've never been able to find all of the smart, qualified people that I've needed, domestic or foreign. And I think that it's pretty much like this all across the valley. Talent adds value that's head and shoulders above salary, so you take it from wherever you can find it.

And yes, if the high school student is smart enough, he can sit down and write good switching code. But finding a high school student who understands software engineering well enough to deal with abstraction, modular code, and tough design issues like scalability is a rare thing indeed.

Tony
jhsmith 12/4/2012 | 9:22:49 PM
re: Lighting Out From Telecom Town Another viewpoint is to look at the examples of people featured in the article (myself being one of them). If any of those engineers who were "spat out into the realm of unemployment" are interested in looking outside of telcom, opportunities still exist for talented and versatile engineers. My particular division of L-3 has hired software engineers (typically JAVA programmers) as well as hardware engineers (typically people skilled with digital/FPGA design and mixed mode design) in the past few months. In fact, we still have openings for about 6 engineers...
dwdm2 12/4/2012 | 9:22:43 PM
re: Lighting Out From Telecom Town "Your ilk also mis-define's team play. Most managers define team play as a willingness to acquiesce to consensus decision making. Real team play is the instinct to consistently place collective interest ahead of one's own."

I agree with flanker. A common practice in many industry is to measure ones ability by the "number of year's" experience. So if someone has 10 years experience, a recruiter and/or a manager will assume that this person is more capable compared to someone who has less number of year's experience.

While in many cases this may be true, in some cases, however, this is just a moronic assumption (IMHO)! Nevertheless, this is what is happening when it comes to hiring. Managers and recruiters (or perhaps the system) does not have a way of looking at the "whole picture" about a candidate, unfortunately.
flanker 12/4/2012 | 9:22:43 PM
re: Lighting Out From Telecom Town For the last decade, I've never been able to find all of the smart, qualified people that I've needed, domestic or foreign.

With all due respect, Tony, that's because you, like most managers, don't know how to screen and interview candidates.

Most executive recruiter and managers over-weight socially-defined indicators and underweight factors like problem-solving ability, work ethic and interest-alignment.

Your ilk also mis-define's team play. Most managers define team play as a willingness to acquiesce to consensus decision making. Real team play is the instinct to consistently place collective interest ahead of one's own.

They aren't the same thing. The former is based on loyalty and conformity and the latter on achieving predefined and measurable goals.

Go figure.


Dr_phill_SoHn 12/4/2012 | 9:22:39 PM
re: Lighting Out From Telecom Town Fellow Disgruntled Dudes,

On H1Bs: There never was a shortage of engineers just a shortage of ones willing to work for under $30K. I have worked with many from universities I have never heard of whom supposedly had PhDs but did not know basic things like F=ma and just what is a dB. What's up with that? Well at least they work on the cheap.

Talent: If you stay at the same job for 10 years in your comfort zone and do the minimum at some corporation you are considered a genius because you built the exact same widget over and over and over and............

Hiring managers: Wake up! If you read a resume which is a perfect match then the person cut and pasted your job description as his resume. You may want to hire someone who can think on there feet and answer questions intelligently.


On PhDs: They are good only if they have some real experience after the degree, otherwise they are useless. I think the current down turn will get rid of some of their entitlement attitudes.

Regards,


Dr Phil, SoHn (School of Hard Knocks)
Yes Dr. Phil has a Ph.D. from UCLA so he knows.

optical_IP 12/4/2012 | 9:22:38 PM
re: Lighting Out From Telecom Town how do u guys hire people ?

do u prefer to hire a candidate whose resume has been forwarded by an employee of ur company / team member
( and fits job requirements .... not necessarly the best, but can do the job)

OR

hire the best available candidate

optical_IP
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