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Option B 12/5/2012 | 5:08:48 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

How many big companies in US have already deals with Huawei/ZTE?


Could they keep it secret for long?

eurichardson 12/5/2012 | 5:11:15 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

This letter is hilarious. Thank you, Mr. Hu.


There are quotes from Abraham Lincoln and Obama, mixed in with a promise to promote human rights in the US, and a call to choose hope over fear.


Thoroughly enjoyed it. Please keep it coming.


Cheers

DCITDave 12/5/2012 | 5:11:25 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

Hey guys,


Keep the posts civil,please. You can be snarky, mean, sarcastic and so on, but let's steer clear of threats and wishing anyone ill will. Let that to the professionals.


As you were.


ph

Telecomguy0704 12/5/2012 | 5:11:27 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

Huawei/ZTE is a PRIVATE company in China. Basically, it cannot act in its own self-interest; without the Chinese Communist Party interferences.

Here is the proof.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2007-07/10/content_6142022.htm

“Primary Party organizations are formed in China's mainland enterprises, rural areas, government departments, schools, scientific research institutes, communities, mass organizations, intermediaries, companies of the People's Liberation Army and other basic units, where there are at least three full Party members.”

How much more proof do we need, to show their 4G/LTE equipments will be good for our national security?



"Ask Huawei what its doing under subsidiary or third party partners with European software engineers in Shenzen area and not limited to that area?
Ask Foxcon what she is doing with the firmware that its embedded in different boards?
Happy outsourcing US and EU"


paolo.franzoi 12/5/2012 | 5:11:33 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

 


None of those was government funded. Government funding means that the money for the research was given by the government in part or in whole.  If you are saying that Government being a user/supporter/builder in response to a technology means that ALL technology was government funded then I guess even FIRE was government funded since I am sure some guy showed some other guy how to make Fire.


 


seven


 

paolo.franzoi 12/5/2012 | 5:11:33 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

Government research funding is very recent.  Think of the following inventions:


1 - The Light Bulb


2 - The Internal Combustion Engine


3 - The Airplane


4 - Television


5 - The Laser


6 - The Integrated Circuit


Even post-WWII, I would argue most technological advances are NOT funded by government research.  WWI was really the first Technology War and WWII really drove lots of research into government (The Manhattan Project being the key). 


seven


 

stratboydave 12/5/2012 | 5:11:33 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

Intersting, so every single item in your list was funded, or propogated by the government. The light bulb! Government funded, and I don't mean by giving Edison a bunch of seed money, there's other ways to fund, like buying a bunch of it, giving right of ways to companies so they can lay the wires etc. That's why we will never really have a truly cometitive telecommunications market - the wires are all owned by the Tier 1 carriers, and the right of ways. Some folks tried to get around this by laying fiber along RR tracks during the dotcom boom - they're are all out of business or acquired.


Internal Combustion Engine - where would the ICE be without roads? All provided by the government. Ongoing research - government funded. Even majority owned by the goverment recently...and the DoD bought tons of them for military purposes thereby kickstarting the industry. I don't think it would have been very successful without some government involvement.


The airplane, seriously? We'd still be flying biplanes and landing on dirt runways if it wasn't for the DoD.


Television, another DUH...


Laser? Invented in a lab funded at least in part by the government for government applications intially, same with fiber optics... Sometimes the government "funds" technology by purchasing it in the early adoptor phase to keep development moving. VoIP would be a good example. Back in the early 2000's the government was the only one buying this stuff in bulk, and by doing so financing continued research and market momentum. And keeping Cisco rolling along even during the dotcom bust.


Integrated Circuit... go back and read your history books, government funded. The US government has it's fingers in every new technology out there way before we even hear about it.


Sure the government is filled with a lot of dead wood and waste but it's also got some of the smartest people on the planet working on research projects at universities that they fund, and have first crack at, and get to decide if they want to release to the public. Case in point, the DoD has been developing and testing umanned flight vehicles/drones for at least 15 years if not longer. When did we first hear about them? Stealth Bomber? Worked on that for 20 years before we even knew it existed... and there's a whole lot more that we won't hear about, ever.

stratboydave 12/5/2012 | 5:11:33 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

LoL, you are correct that the goverment doesn't actually invent any technology but they sure fund a whole bunch. Almost every technological advance, including the internet, can be traced to a US government funded research project.


The government knows how to scale techonology, that's what they're good at, not great but good. If you don't think that NSA and the government are using bleeding edge technology then you obviously haven't spent much time in the environment. The government, and the DoD in partiucular are using technology today that you won't see commercially for at least 5-10 years. They also use some of the oldest technology, think 3270, since the apps were written for it.


Can you buy a system commercially that will perform IDS at the photon level? The feds are already doing it... and that's just the stuff that's public. Having grown up in DC I can assure you that the stuff they make public is probably years behind what they are currently doing. There's no way they're going to let anyone know what they're really doing and NSA has a blind budget. They don't have to tell anyone what the money is for, or what they're going to do with it, blank check... you can buy a whole lot of tech with a blank check, massive amounts.

stratboydave 12/5/2012 | 5:11:34 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

It's a communist country. Don't trust them. Don't buy Chinese made goods unless I absolutely have to. Definitely would not buy any network gear from them. If I was in the goverment, especaially DoD, I wouln't even talk to them. They are not our friend or "ally", they are our enemy. Keep your friends close, keep your enemies closer... but under intense scrutiny.

bollocks187 12/5/2012 | 5:11:38 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

Let get real this is simple a case of the US companies petitioning the govt for protection. Why its simple they make products as good as the West at half the price i.e. its ALL BS.


WHile it is acceptbale to manufactuer Everything in CHINA. The Chinese govt could  turn of the spigot and we would get no equipment in the West - nothing. 


So there is nothing to protect anymore the world has changed.


If Huawei is not allowed to compete in the USA, then one can argue that quid pro quo may occur and the Chinese govt can turn nasty and put force it telecom folks to complete elminate all western products and replace with chinese now matter how inferior. This would put a dent in Western companies bank balance. In addition a manufacturing tax increase of 5% would also add money to the coffers.


 


 

bollocks187 12/5/2012 | 5:11:38 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

Are you kidding me the NSA and the USA Govt are lame ducks when it comes to telecom technology.


To thinkthe US Govt has a handle on technology you have got to be fooling yourself or watching to many Hollywood movies.


LOL


 


 


 

bollocks187 12/5/2012 | 5:11:38 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

TelecomGuy,


 


How could we allow ALL the manufacturing to be done in China ?


There is no manufacturing jobs in the West cause tis cheaper in China. They control the situation already - you just don't realize it.


 


 


 

photon2 12/5/2012 | 5:11:40 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

I think we have to all remember that all equipment is 'hackable', back doors are hard to find and exist in all sorts of routers and optical equipment no matter where they are placed or what country they reside in.


Now, having said that, allowing any one vendor too much leverage in any network for any reason despite the extent they prove their 'compliance' (btw, NSN is compliant now only because of all the slush $ they got caught spending), is not a likely safe route. 


Given that much of our appliances today and tomorrow come from China, we'll have to let go of some of these fears.  Fact is, if Huawei hadn't been 'caught' doing things in some networks this might be easier for them.


P2

billy_fold 12/5/2012 | 5:11:53 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

John,


Get a clue; buy one if you have to.


-billy

Telecomguy0704 12/5/2012 | 5:11:54 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

Sprint has a very good Network Security expert team and below is the outcome selection of their 4G network upgrade infrastructure vendors. To me, Sprint management team is truly visionary, as they have foreseen the potential problem ahead.

Report: Sprint excludes Huawei, ZTE from network project over security concerns

http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/report-sprint-excludes-huawei-zte-bids-network-project/2010-11-05

I believe that we have a right to be concerned and knowing that our communication network infrastructure is so critically important to our day-to-day lives.

How could we allow a PRIVATE company from a Communist Party controlled country (like China) to build and to influent/control our communication network infrastructure; especially, anything to do with the LTE/4G networks?

As they said "Vision is not seeing as they are, but as they will be.".

Thank you all, for listening.


jeanva 12/5/2012 | 5:11:56 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

the interest rate of load is not known, 

John Zhao 12/5/2012 | 5:11:57 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

American - Sux

Telecomguy0704 12/5/2012 | 5:11:59 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

A note for LTE/4G Operators, from the eNB, it’s quite easily to hack into EPC nodes. Once got into the S-GW/P-GW nodes, all data can be tapped. Selected important data from EPC nodes can also be collected and embedded into various logs through hidden backdoor code and be sent via the e-UTRAN access.

 

 In the open letter, it mentioned about the army (PLA), but the fact is, in China, the Communist Party of China (CPC) controls everything. PLA is only an apparatus of the CPC. If one ever lived in China, one would know that most political/business deals and decision making process are opaque and shrouded in secrecy mode.

 

 

Other interesting links and articles about CPC, Huawei might be worth reading are shown below. 

 

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2007-07/10/content_6142022.htm


“Primary Party organizations are formed in China's mainland enterprises, rural areas, government departments, schools, scientific research institutes, communities, mass organizations, intermediaries, companies of the People's Liberation Army and other basic units, where there are at least three full Party members.”

------

<h1 style="margin: auto 0in;">ACG Research on Huawei, Chinese business culture and the Art of War</h1>
<h1 style="margin: auto 0in;">http://searchtelecom.techtarget.com/feature/ACG-Research-on-Huawei-Chinese-business-culture-and-the-Art-of-War?asrc=EM_USC_13048542&amp;track=NL-854&amp;ad=804294</h1>
<h1 style="margin: auto 0in;">&nbsp;</h1>
<h1 style="margin: auto 0in;">ACG Research on Huawei vs. network equipment vendors </h1>
<h1 style="margin: auto 0in;">http://searchtelecom.techtarget.com/feature/ACG-Research-on-Huawei-vs-network-equipment-vendors</h1>
<h1 style="margin: auto 0in;">&nbsp;</h1>

paolo.franzoi 12/5/2012 | 5:12:01 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

bigbro,


1. I hope they do, but the barrier to getting that information will be higher than it is for US based firms.


2. I don't believe they are clean necessarily, but it is a lower bar to risk then having products designed completely in the domain of a foreign government.


seven


&nbsp;

BigBro 12/5/2012 | 5:12:03 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

1. What makes you think that the NSA doesn't already have all the source code/schematics/... for Huawei products? ;)


2. What makes you think that all the foreign nationals working as engineers at U.S. companies in the U.S. are trustworthy? For that matter, that U.S. citizens are above and beyond being blackmailed/bribed/... by foreign entities?

kaka 12/5/2012 | 5:12:04 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

The stand made by Hu could be legitimate but I had the following comments:


Investing in a telecom infrastructure is strategic and one needs to have processes and mechanisms to protect oneself. Just having a willingness to have your products undergo scrutiny is insufficient to get access to the market. Huawei is a privately held company based in China (notorious for IP theft) with no transparency and accountability. How can a company which is not public expect to gain access to the world's biggest market.&nbsp;


In fact they should have a law that prohibits companies to buy strategic investments from non-public companies.


&nbsp;


&nbsp;

kaka 12/5/2012 | 5:12:04 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

The stand made by Hu could be legitimate but I had the following comments:


Investing in a telecom infrastructure is strategic and one needs to have processes and mechanisms to protect oneself. Just having a willingness to have your products undergo scrutiny is insufficient to get access to the market. Huawei is a privately held company based in China (notorious for IP theft) with no transparency and accountability. How can a company which is not public expect to gain access to the world's biggest market.&nbsp;


In fact they should have a law that prohibits companies to buy strategic investments from non-public companies.


&nbsp;


&nbsp;

paolo.franzoi 12/5/2012 | 5:12:05 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US


Here is where I come from. &nbsp;If you project out 10 &ndash; 20 years, China will have its entire communication infrastructure built by Chinese Companies by Chinese Engineers. &nbsp;What that means is that they will be the only country entirely in control of their own communications infrastructure. &nbsp;I think that this is a great national security move by the Chinese Government. &nbsp;It will certainly make it much harder for US spy agencies to penetrate them and just as importantly make their infrastructure more immune to external attack.

What I think is misunderstood is that our infrastructure is very important to our day to day lives. Energy, Water, Transportation and Communications are essential for our society to function. &nbsp;Imagine a day when nobody in the US could make a call, send a text or use the Internet. &nbsp;I am not sure there would be &ldquo;panic in the streets&rdquo; but if it lasted for very long the US economy and our lives would be hurt very badly.

The problem I have with Huawei (and ZTE and any other equivalent) is that having that equipment in our networks make it more likely that we are vulnerable to these attacks. &nbsp;It is not Huawei&rsquo;s fault. &nbsp;I don&rsquo;t think the people that work there are evil or bad people. &nbsp;But I am confused on why anybody thinks its a good idea to hand what is an enemy state the keys to cratering your economy. &nbsp;Just like I would not oursource Tank or Fighter Jet design to a Chinese Arms manufacture, I think it is an awful idea to outsource communications (or energy or transportation or water or &lt;add your favorite infrastructure&gt;) to a country that is not an ally. &nbsp;

Think about the deal that Alcatel had to make to be allowed to by Lucent. &nbsp;I am still wary over that whole thing (we just handed away one of the great research assets of the past to a foreign power). &nbsp;

My views are clearly quite parochial and old fashion realpolitik. &nbsp;I have not found human behavior to have changed over time, so I don&rsquo;t believe that the Chinese are happy to be a minor player in the world (that was a modern oddity of history). &nbsp;They have viewed us as rivals and so I think we need to defend ourselves. &nbsp;If that means we don&rsquo;t buy products from Huawei and ZTE then so be it.&nbsp;




seven


&nbsp;


PS - http://www.cnn.com/2011/TECH/s...





quicktime 12/5/2012 | 5:12:06 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

Though the fact is not true.


I am curious at of the logic behind the induction.


Think about GM, AIG, GS, MS, BOA, JPM


They are all backed by your tax money directly.


&nbsp;


Engineering is engineering.&nbsp; Be rational and be simple.


&nbsp;


&nbsp;

JeddChen 12/5/2012 | 5:12:06 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

I agree with you.


many major IT/CT vendors, like Ericson, the leading solution provider is now recruiting people in China to develop media network and mobile core network.


check the link:&nbsp;http://topic.csdn.net/u/20110119/10/f8b48d8a-ca8d-43b4-8bee-8a77f08287dd.html.


&nbsp;


According the point of view of Mr. Seven, this famous&nbsp;European company&nbsp;can sell it solutions to USA? I don't think that Ericson has asked NSA or third party to check all "hole" in its solution. Be careful, it is made in China:-)


Qualcom is also recruiting now on website of www.52rd.com. check the link:


http://www.52rd.com/Tech/Company/?CID=Qualcomm&amp;FID=5&amp;ClassID=Job

paolo.franzoi 12/5/2012 | 5:12:08 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

&nbsp;


My take is that the NSA has already hacked all Cisco and Juniper products (as well as Alcatel and Erricson routers). &nbsp;The idea is that they get the Huawei gear so they can hack all the Chinese Government Communications. &nbsp;


If it were me I would actually ban ALL imports from China and default on the debt owed them, but that is me. &nbsp;We live in a Global Economy but the US for now is still several times the size of the Chinese Economy.


Engineering is one thing, manufacturing is another. &nbsp;I said engineering to be specific. &nbsp;If it is designed in China you should assume that the Chinese Government can use it to hack your networks. &nbsp;Really think this is a good idea when we are on a collision course with China?


seven


&nbsp;

pdonegan67 12/5/2012 | 5:12:08 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US



Governments are entitled to their concerns, whatever they may be. Under a democratic system, there is nothing more sacred than a citizen's right to expect that their security will never be knowingly compromised by those they elected.

The interesting question for me is when you have a company like Huawei which is increasingly leading and defining the telecom industry&rsquo;s future technology roadmap, at what point does a country&rsquo;s global competitiveness start to be hindered by denying its service providers access to a major technology leader? And at what point does throttling back on competitiveness actually become&nbsp;a greater national security risk than the risk supposedly posed by the presence in the network of a Chinese vendor?

You might argue that Verizon's networks&nbsp;seems to be doing perfectly well in delivering leading&nbsp;wireline and wireless services without Huawei, thank you very much. In wireless, for example, Verizon is the world leader in 4G LTE deployment as well as in ARPU projections, for goodness sake.

But project that five or ten years further out and how competitive will Verizon remain if it only sticks with its current suppliers?&nbsp;Just as importantly, how can Sprint, AT&amp;T and T-Mobile be expected to stay competitive in the interests of American businesses and consumers unless they&rsquo;re able to have access to all the best network technology?

However legitimate the motivations of the politicians and the spooks, it seems to me that the balance of risk is bound to shift over time.&nbsp; Last October Heavy Reading&nbsp;published a report looking at the lengths to which the world's largest vendors, most notably Huawei and NSN, are going to demonstrate&nbsp;their security&nbsp;credentials. &nbsp;http://www.heavyreading.com/details.asp?sku_id=2613&amp;skuitem_itemid=1288&amp;promo_code=&amp;aff_code=&amp;next_url=%2Flist%2Easp%3Fpage%5Ftype%3Dall%5Freports. Interestingly, the only major vendor that refused to contribute to the report was Cisco, citing reasons of, ahem, "security". Go figure. It's a funny thing this security business&hellip;.




paolo.franzoi 12/5/2012 | 5:12:09 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

&nbsp;


My take is that we should ban all Chinese engineered products from the comm network in the US.&nbsp; It is simply too big a hole for security.&nbsp; If Huawei were willing to create a wall and do all of its development for US sold products in the US, then I would consider buying from them.&nbsp; An alternative would be that they deliver every schematic and line of source for every version of every product that they build to the NSA.&nbsp; Once the NSA declares it good, then we can allow it in.


&nbsp;


seven


&nbsp;

lowprofile 12/5/2012 | 5:12:09 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

The loan given by China Development Bank to Huawei's customers are for buying Huawei's products and services, right?&nbsp;


China Development Bank is controlled by Chinese government, right?


The customer that gets the loan uses it to pay Huawei, right?


The bank does not provide the same loan to Cisco or Juniper or Brocade customers, right?


---


If the above is correct, then the logical conclusion is Huawei is indeed financially supported by the Chinese government to the extent to $30billion, which is a lot!

keepsimple 12/5/2012 | 5:12:09 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

This letter is long overdue. I am wondering if Cisco / Juniper / Motorola are fully restricted in China?


&nbsp;

Taporirz 12/5/2012 | 5:12:09 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

Seven, in that case I suggest you start buying some stamps for postage because its probably the only means of communication that you could use that won't require any product "engineered" in China. We live in a global economy in which an ecosystem exists&nbsp;and development is done&nbsp;across many regions.&nbsp;&nbsp;Every major viable vendor in the world today has some development in China or atleast some component that is developed in China.&nbsp; So from your absolute statement the NSA&nbsp;should be very busy verifying everyones code.


General comments like "it is simply too big a hole for security" is an insult to the technical community.&nbsp;


TaporiRZ

moon_shot 12/5/2012 | 5:38:19 PM
re: Huawei's Open Letter to the US

Huawei stole every single IP document from Nortel Networks over a 10 year period, as recently reported globally.&nbsp; Hmmm.&nbsp; Sounds like an upstanding and forthright company to me.


&nbsp;

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