re: Cisco's Chambers Glows at N+Ilet-there-be-light makes a good point as a matter of fact.
LU, NT, Alcatel etc are much more exposed to the telecoms downturn than Cisco. Cisco to their credit is a lot more resilient to a sector or regional downturn in spending than many of its peers.
The fact is the SP arm missed their expectations by a reasonable amount and this shortfall was covered by the enterprise. Government, health, defence etc these guys still spend money. Carriers dont.
I can understand why Extreme bounced on the news but why Juniper? There's no good news in this announcement for juniper is there?
re: Cisco's Chambers Glows at N+IJust a couple of comments as a ex-cisco employee who should be bitter at cisco but isn't
*1. Management team are all now Mario cronies or *GMs that go home at 5 Not sure where you work but the guys I know that are still there work almost as many hours as they use to
*5. No successor to Chamber I think many people are aware that one of the prime candidates to replace chambers is PPA Pierre-Paul Allard (I personally think this guy could do a better job)
* 6. Big losses in Cable sector and nothing * happening in Wireless Wireless isn't really a market in full expansion right now as the rest of the industry its felling the cut backs look at Ericsson or Nortel (the 2 biggest wireless companies in the world) and you will see noone is expanding right now...
* 10. Morale sucks. I have to give you this one... people are still missing the glory days of the Bubble Ages but most aren't leaving... thruth is there is nothing better to leave to right now.
I miss Cisco but I'm happy I am gone I can now concentrate my energy on whats important... my family.
re: Cisco's Chambers Glows at N+I1. Management team are all now Mario cronies or GMs that go home at 5 2. No new growth markets 3. Losses to carriers still not on books. What about the lending bloodbath at Sigma Networks 4. Low-end enterprise is going to Dell and Netgear 5. No successor to Chamber 6. Big losses in Cable sector and nothing happening in Wireless 7 EPS is toast at 8BN share float 8. All of the BD shop invested personally and made money at the start-ups Cisco acquired...their Enron story is still to come out 9. Chambers will have to pay off the class action suits for the 30%-50% guidance he was giving until a quarter ago 10. Morale sucks. I am getting out as soon as we hit 20. Hope I don't get crushed in the stampede. Only people left will be the HP clones
re: Cisco's Chambers Glows at N+Ibuliwyf, let-there-be-light, wiliecoyote...
great discussion. all with good points. I think ltbl makes the best arguement in terms of Cisco being fairly well insulated against the telecom fall. The 154545 is selling very well. Not a great box, but it does the job and is in many large networks. Enterprise, Government and education markets have been fairly immune to this telecom disaster...
I think you will see even a lot of the large telecom manufacturers doing niche plays focusing on profitability while we ride the rough road...
re: Cisco's Chambers Glows at N+Imy furry acme distributor of flawed explosive products:
You said: "Consider this: Cisco, with their cash and market cap, can buy almost all of these companies combined."
I was giving your post a lot of credit until you said that. Boy, how naive you really are. Chambers would probably argue "what are you buying?" and let's not forget the assets of these companies less the cash... While NT and LU are not demonstrating great management practices, their assets alone are worth far more than Cisco's market cap. Read the Annual reports.
To your credit, Cisco is a good bet, period. Cisco does have rock-solid management. Nortel and Lucent could especially take lessons on how to run an company and not be so greedy. Chambers taking virtually no salary while these other execs are cashing in.. Makes me sick.
Hey, I'm not against a legal pyramid scheme (corporate America) as long as the guy on top truly shares in the risk/reward. So when LU and NT are junk bond status, these guys are getting rich. No surprise for class action suits when this goes on. Simply put, when the company does well, they deserve to do well. When it is not, they should be collecting unemployment. The shareholders should not tolerate this.
I applaud Mr. Chambers for his upbeat attitude. You can bet it will be contagious to all the troops when morale is low for the competition.
re: Cisco's Chambers Glows at N+IIt's really an interesting exercise to compare management practices in Cisco vs Nortel/Lucent. Maybe there is (or if it is not, it should be) a MBA course that does that? Cisco managed to have a fantastic growth in good (exceptional?) years and when the downturn came, they did one big layoff (that hurt, ouch), circled the wagons and tried to survive. On the other hand, Nortel tried to do a 90 degree turn in good years (and to pass Cisco), hired zillions of people without the real vision/market research/commitment, boosted its exec salaries and bonuses, and when the bad times came, only ordinary employees suffered (and been laid off) while execs still rolled in money. More of less applies to Lucent too. Yes, Cisco had a big cash reserve in the bank (and some of the positives in the previous quarter's results came from the interest on that cash!), but NT and LU spent their cash on exec's bonuses and fantastic buildings (yes, those are assets but to whom they are going to sell them?). Too bad that my options expired, as it seems that the Cisco will survive this bloodbath (should I feel lucky that I don't own NT and LU ;)
re: Cisco's Chambers Glows at N+ILU I believe raised $14mil selling a private golf course and executive retreat complex in central NJ. if anyone visited their holmdel campus, look at the vast lawns , the army of security, the huge lobby and the 6 storey atrium with palm trees inside. I never seen anything like it.
such things are unheard of in csco.
now my LU friends tell me even coffee and milk are not being provided, they bring their own mugs to work :)
LU, NT, Alcatel etc are much more exposed to the telecoms downturn than Cisco.
Cisco to their credit is a lot more resilient to a sector or regional downturn in spending than many of its peers.
The fact is the SP arm missed their expectations by a reasonable amount and this shortfall was covered by the enterprise. Government, health, defence etc these guys still spend money. Carriers dont.
I can understand why Extreme bounced on the news but why Juniper? There's no good news in this announcement for juniper is there?
*1. Management team are all now Mario cronies or *GMs that go home at 5
Not sure where you work but the guys I know that are still there work almost as many hours as they use to
*5. No successor to Chamber
I think many people are aware that one of the prime candidates to replace chambers is PPA Pierre-Paul Allard (I personally think this guy could do a better job)
* 6. Big losses in Cable sector and nothing
* happening in Wireless
Wireless isn't really a market in full expansion right now as the rest of the industry its felling the cut backs look at Ericsson or Nortel (the 2 biggest wireless companies in the world) and you will see noone is expanding right now...
* 10. Morale sucks.
I have to give you this one... people are still missing the glory days of the Bubble Ages but most aren't leaving... thruth is there is nothing better to leave to right now.
I miss Cisco but I'm happy I am gone I can now concentrate my energy on whats important... my family.
2. No new growth markets
3. Losses to carriers still not on books. What about the lending bloodbath at Sigma Networks
4. Low-end enterprise is going to Dell and Netgear
5. No successor to Chamber
6. Big losses in Cable sector and nothing happening in Wireless
7 EPS is toast at 8BN share float
8. All of the BD shop invested personally and made money at the start-ups Cisco acquired...their Enron story is still to come out
9. Chambers will have to pay off the class action suits for the 30%-50% guidance he was giving until a quarter ago
10. Morale sucks. I am getting out as soon as we hit 20. Hope I don't get crushed in the stampede. Only people left will be the HP clones
great discussion. all with good points. I think ltbl makes the best arguement in terms of Cisco being fairly well insulated against the telecom fall. The 154545 is selling very well. Not a great box, but it does the job and is in many large networks. Enterprise, Government and education markets have been fairly immune to this telecom disaster...
I think you will see even a lot of the large telecom manufacturers doing niche plays focusing on profitability while we ride the rough road...
-HTRN
You said:
"Consider this: Cisco, with their cash and market cap, can buy almost all of these companies combined."
I was giving your post a lot of credit until you said that. Boy, how naive you really are. Chambers would probably argue "what are you buying?" and let's not forget the assets of these companies less the cash... While NT and LU are not demonstrating great management practices, their assets alone are worth far more than Cisco's market cap. Read the Annual reports.
To your credit, Cisco is a good bet, period. Cisco does have rock-solid management. Nortel and Lucent could especially take lessons on how to run an company and not be so greedy. Chambers taking virtually no salary while these other execs are cashing in.. Makes me sick.
Hey, I'm not against a legal pyramid scheme (corporate America) as long as the guy on top truly shares in the risk/reward. So when LU and NT are junk bond status, these guys are getting rich. No surprise for class action suits when this goes on. Simply put, when the company does well, they deserve to do well. When it is not, they should be collecting unemployment. The shareholders should not tolerate this.
I applaud Mr. Chambers for his upbeat attitude. You can bet it will be contagious to all the troops when morale is low for the competition.
-HTRN
Cisco managed to have a fantastic growth in good (exceptional?) years and when the downturn came, they did one big layoff (that hurt, ouch), circled the wagons and tried to survive. On the other hand, Nortel tried to do a 90 degree turn in good years (and to pass Cisco), hired zillions of people without the real vision/market research/commitment, boosted its exec salaries and bonuses, and when the bad times came, only ordinary employees suffered (and been laid off) while execs still rolled in money. More of less applies to Lucent too.
Yes, Cisco had a big cash reserve in the bank (and some of the positives in the previous quarter's results came from the interest on that cash!), but NT and LU spent their cash on exec's bonuses and fantastic buildings (yes, those are assets but to whom they are going to sell them?).
Too bad that my options expired, as it seems that the Cisco will survive this bloodbath (should I feel lucky that I don't own NT and LU ;)
Are you suggesting that a San Jose campus is less-expensive than a Holmdel NJ building with palm trees?
course and executive retreat complex in central
NJ. if anyone visited their holmdel campus, look
at the vast lawns , the army of security, the
huge lobby and the 6 storey atrium with palm trees
inside. I never seen anything like it.
such things are unheard of in csco.
now my LU friends tell me even coffee and milk
are not being provided, they bring their own mugs
to work :)