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Optical/IP

Li Quits Procket

This week is a pivotal one for router maker Procket Networks Inc. The company announced a huge customer -- its largest product deployment to date. But the news was somewhat overshadowed by the loss of two top executives, including Procket founder Tony Li.

Procket today revealed the details of big core routing deployment with Australia's Academic and Research Network (AARNet), where Procket was chosen over chief rivals Cisco Systems Inc. (Nasdaq: CSCO) and Juniper Networks Inc. (Nasdaq: JNPR). On Monday, however, Light Reading sources say, the company told its employees that Chief Scientist Li has turned in his resignation.

Also at that Monday meeting, Procket brass announced that Vito Palermo, the company's chief operating officer, has left the company as well.

Procket spokesmen confirmed Palermo's departure, but declined to address Li's situation directly. "We don’t discuss personnel issues externally," says Cary Hayward, director of marketing for Procket.

"I can tell you that Vito has resigned his position here... and we're going to miss him," Hayward, then added, with apparently no intended irony.

Of course, it's no wonder Procket is hesitant to talk about Li's resignation now: He's still technically employed by the company and is working with AARNet right now to make sure their deployment goes smoothly.

It's that customer win -- and Li's work there -- that Procket's public relations team is keeping in front of the media as its management shakeup continues. "This is the largest award we've received to date," says Hayward.

"Despite strong bids from Cisco and Juniper, we've chosen relative newcomer Procket to power our network," George McLaughlin, AARNet's director for international developments told the tech publication Australian IT on Monday.

Meanwhile, evidence is piling up that Li is not long for Procket. "I will continue with my 'tour of duty' here in Australia, but will be leaving the company after that," Li wrote in a note to fellow Procket employees, according to one Light Reading source. "I do not like letting you down, but the alternative to doing so is far worse. I cannot go into it further, I just hope you will trust me when I say that there are some things that a man has to do if he wants to retain his basic ethics and morals."

Li could not be reached to elaborate on the note, its source, or his employment status.

Palermo left Procket because he had wanted to succeed Randall Kruep as Procket's CEO, according to a former Procket executive. Procket's board instead recruited Cisco VP Roland Acra for the top spot.

It's not clear whether Palermo's and Li's departures were at all connected. A call to Palermo at home was not returned.

What is clear is that there's no mistaking how influential Li is to Procket.

Procket was founded in 1999 as a network processor company created by William Lynch, lead architect for Sun Microsystems Inc.'s (Nasdaq: SUNW) UltraSparc 4 microprocessor, and invested in by the likes of Cisco.

Li, another Procket founder, came aboard to devise software to make the chips suitable for routers. Li provided the systems expertise chip companies crave, as he had worked on Juniper's M40 and Cisco's GSR 12000 core routers.

After Procket's board decided it should be a router company instead of a chip maker, the company faced loads of promising startups, including Charlotte's Web Networks, IronBridge Networks, and Pluris -- none of which are still around.

Procket's staying power always resided in its top-flight technology and technical talent, as well as its ability to constantly attract loads of funding. To date, Procket has raised more than $300 million, the most recent installment being a $30 million deal (see Procket Stuffing Its Pocket).

Procket lore surrounding Li always makes for a long day at the water cooler. He's been said to butt heads with Procket's previous CEOs and senior managers. He has also quit his past jobs after allegedly becoming dissatisfied, leaving millions of unvested stock options on the table at each place (see Procket CEO Resigns).

But there's no question Li put his stamp on Procket. Its first CEO was Sharad Mehrotra, who was replaced as CEO by Redback sales exec Randall Kruep in 2001. Kruep resigned last June, with Acra taking his place earlier this month (see Kruep Leaves Redback for Procket, Procket CEO Resigns, and Procket Gets Cisco Exec). Li had a hand in Kruep's undoing, as well as Acra's hiring, according to Light Reading sources close to Procket.

Now folks will question whether Procket is as viable a company if and when Tony Li acts on his resignation. Procket would argue it is, especially given today's customer announcement, an important one for Procket in its quest to be considered a serious contender for large carrier networks.

Others aren't so sure; Procket and Li are inextricably linked in their minds. "If this doesn't put the nail in the coffin, I'd be surprised," says Esmeralda Swartz, VP of marketing at Procket competitor Avici Systems Inc. (Nasdaq: AVCI; Frankfurt: BVC7). "It's only one guy, but Tony Li sort of is Procket. The other folks don't have the same persona."

— Phil Harvey, News Editor, and Craig Matsumoto, Senior Editor, Light Reading

Tony Li 12/5/2012 | 2:14:40 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Of course not! But the way people here talk about him and how he's portrayed in the press releases sure make it sound like he's devine. He is a great figurehead for getting press coverage and funding, but as far as being technical, there are many who are in the same league. Radia Perlman, Dave Katz, Paul Traina, Yakov Rekhter, John Moy, Ross Callon, just to name a few. There are many more unsung heroes who do are just as good as Li but do not get the publicity.

Tony, please chime in and give credit to the other folks where credit is due.
------------------

This one has been bugging me and I can now set the record straight. Yes, there are many other folks who deserve far more credit and publicity than I do. Your list above, plus some other names like Oran, Chiappa, and Halpern should be included. The list is quite long. The visibility that has been thrust upon me is neither deserved nor welcome and has simply been a convenient tool for others to further their own ends.

I am simply one honest and stubborn man trying to help build the Internet. My value is not in any particular technical area but in the fact that I am a perfectionist, trying to do a good job for my customers and my company. I share the original vision of the Internet as THE communcations infrastructure for the forseeable future and I do what I can to move the Internet forward. Unlike many others in the industry, I am unwilling to lead my customers down the garden path to make a sale and from that, I believe, I have a long standing relationship with Tier 1 network engineers.

To those that feel that there is some competition as to who is the "coolest", I'll point out that there is no real competition. Only one person on the above list is also an international name in rock n' roll. When it comes to cool, I'm not even in the running.

Tony
vr100 12/5/2012 | 2:30:10 AM
re: Li Quits Procket You got it in reverse.
opticalwatcher 12/5/2012 | 2:30:13 AM
re: Li Quits Procket "Perhaps I am naive...but at least I'm not trying to sell my products on a LR chat board"

Gee, you attack his router and he defends them point-by-point, and then you the accuse him of advertising.

Is it a requirement of the message board that all criticisms of products be one-sided? That would be very depressing! Maybe they can call it the "Lightreading Shootout" section.
Mezo 12/5/2012 | 2:30:19 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Perhaps I am naive...but at least I'm not trying to sell my products on a LR chat board...hardware maybe you can find new talent...but in software you've got to keep the coders to be consist & maintain quality of those features...you know that...or you don't.

...and do us all a favor and buy more banners from LR...it's better for your image...then byteme2 :]

See you at lunch...
byteme3 12/5/2012 | 2:30:31 AM
re: Li Quits Procket >The biggest problem Avici has is that it has >been bleeding talent for years and there is no >one left to enhance the box...I know because >many of my friends were there an have moved on...

If you think companies don't lose people and hire other people then you are naive. Since we continue to release new linecards and software features, we seem to have handled the downturn well. Avici, like every vendor out there, had layoffs during the lean years, which no one wanted. It is a horrible, horrible experience for all involved. But we have still been able to advance hardware and software even during the bad times, and have been hiring for the upturn since.
No one is irreplaceable - even Tony Li. :)
byteme3 12/5/2012 | 2:30:32 AM
re: Li Quits Procket >Avici has no advantage at all. Its an old, tired
>product with no particular postives.

Well, that's an interesting spin. Since avici has been releasing new linecards and software features continuously since our inception, you must be referring to the chassis as the "old" part. Actually we've been introducing new chassis sizes, too, but the architecture of them is similar. But yes you can still run the chassis from 4 years ago with today's newest linecards, but isn't that a good thing?
Or maybe you're referring to the fabric design, in that it's still toroidal? We have increased the speed of it for higher capacity cards, but you're right it still supports the older speed too. The funny thing is avici considers that one of their big advantages: you don't have to throw out the older linecards when you buy new capacity ones. They can work in the same system. We don't think replacing the whole box every 24 months is the right approach for a carrier. How is that wrong?
Belzebutt 12/5/2012 | 2:30:55 AM
re: Li Quits Procket They have now engaged a partner in nortel where
nobody except the CFO liked the deal and the
sales force is unmotivated to even try to sell
something they know nobody wants. And its not
because of cost. Its because the quality of the
product is poor, Avici support is horrible and
the company as a whole specializes in making
promises they can't keep.



coreghost,
You're obviously not an NT insider. :)
coreghost 12/5/2012 | 2:30:57 AM
re: Li Quits Procket
Avici has no advantage at all. Its an old, tired
product with no particular postives. Avici
has made the rounds of every carrier in the
business at least three times now with the
same product. And they keep getting told
"no" for bunches of reasons.

Their only real customer remains ATT. That
is, not counting fake customer announcements or
wishful thinking on their part.

They have now engaged a partner in nortel where
nobody except the CFO liked the deal and the
sales force is unmotivated to even try to sell
something they know nobody wants. And its not
because of cost. Its because the quality of the
product is poor, Avici support is horrible and
the company as a whole specializes in making
promises they can't keep.

Mezo 12/5/2012 | 2:31:11 AM
re: Li Quits Procket The biggest problem with Avici is not their box...although most service providers have looked at it already and passed on it...

The biggest problem Avici has is that it has been bleeding talent for years and there is no one left to enhance the box...I know because many of my friends were there an have moved on...

It does appear that Avici does have one last spin doctor on staff...well done byteme3

p.s. docs=bullshit like any routers 99.999% availability :]
muxbux 12/5/2012 | 2:31:26 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Avici Certainly has some superior advantages over the Cisco Juniper solutions. The issue is the ability to sell High cost cap ex gear in a slowly returning marketspace. the other guys have more product depth to carry them through these times. Avici has one of the best architectures in the business... IMHO
mr zippy 12/5/2012 | 2:31:30 AM
re: Li Quits Procket http://www.aarnet.edu.au/

AARNet are involved in a few fairly significant projects for a country the size of the US, with 20 million people, and only 7 major capital cities.

truthbob 12/5/2012 | 2:31:30 AM
re: Li Quits Procket >> http://www.aarnet.edu.au/

>> AARNet are involved in a few fairly
>> significant projects for a country the size
>> of the US, with 20 million people, and only
>> 7 major capital cities.

An aggregate of <200 mbit/s according to http://www.aarnet.edu.au/netwo... . . .
mboeing 12/5/2012 | 2:31:48 AM
re: Li Quits Procket "mboeing wrote:
I had GSR test labs bigger then that.

Well let's see - 12 8812's = 480GB per chassis x 12 = 5760GB total.

With a 12416, 16 slots @ 10GB minus 2 for RP's = 14 x 10GB = 140GB per chassis. So 5760 / 140 = 41 12416 chassis to equal the capacity of 12 8812's.

You must have a really big power bill....

JC will love you when you upgrade to the 12816!"

I must admit that I was talking about number of boxes, not switching capacity. Usually I do not use fully loaded boxes in my labs.

/Markus.
firstmiler 12/5/2012 | 2:32:13 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Last I checked, Frank Lloyd Wright ended up divorcing his first wife and leaving his many children without their father. He, like all of us, was/is not perfect.

My guess is that in passing on to the here after he was a bit humbled to find this out posthumously.

All of us can be appropriately humble without being hypocritical, and all arrogance is not honest.
metrocore 12/5/2012 | 2:32:13 AM
re: Li Quits Procket AUTHOR: Frank Lloyd Wright
QUOTATION: Early in life I had to choose between honest arrogance and hypocritical humility. I chose honest arrogance and have seen no occasion to change
BobbyMax 12/5/2012 | 2:32:24 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Neither Juniper nor Cisco has submitted their product for evaluation who truly have the expertise. I hope these two companies would submit their products for evaluation by experts. Most of the products from these companies are buyers and have no qualificatiobs to evaluate products or technology.

Cisco and Juniper would not permit University of Hampshire and Tolly Systems for independent evaluations.
Iipoed 12/5/2012 | 2:32:29 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Tony Li may have an ego, I don't know him so I can't say. But if he does his accomplishments and knowledge certainly give him the credentials for a big ego.

BM has no ego, he is an idiot that services vending machines.
bobbbymax 12/5/2012 | 2:32:32 AM
re: Li Quits Procket First of all you should not be immitating and write something without any significant real time experience. You are a disgrace full living on our earth. I must advise you to get education and read prominent newspapers that can open up your clogged mind and open eyes. You one of the parasites living on our sacred motherland.

you ....... who ?
BobbyMax 12/5/2012 | 2:32:34 AM
re: Li Quits Procket First of all you should not be immitating and write something without any significant real time experience. You are a disgrace full living on our earth. I must advise you to get education and read prominent newspapers that can open up your clogged mind and open eyes. You one of the parasites living on our sacred motherland.
Scott Raynovich 12/5/2012 | 2:32:56 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Tony,

If you're out there... please contact us at [email protected]

I have a quick question...

--Scott
DocGonzo 12/5/2012 | 2:32:56 AM
re: Li Quits Procket "Does anyone know when Mr. Li is due back, and has anyone verified the email existed?
I understand that Mr. Li has resigned (even in company meetings) and changed his mind later. This could easily happen again, so conjecture on his leaving may be quite pre-mature."

Well, I read it on LightReading, so it must be true!

Doc
answeris42 12/5/2012 | 2:33:02 AM
re: Li Quits Procket And Mark Twain = Sam Clemens..

BTW folks the coyote and signmeup have great insight into what's really happening at Procket.
grunt 12/5/2012 | 2:33:02 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Does anyone know when Mr. Li is due back, and has anyone verified the email existed?
I understand that Mr. Li has resigned (even in company meetings) and changed his mind later. This could easily happen again, so conjecture on his leaving may be quite pre-mature.
grunt 12/5/2012 | 2:33:02 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Does anyone know when Mr. Li is due back, and has anyone verified the email existed?
I understand that Mr. Li has resigned (even in company meetings) and changed his mind later. This could easily happen again, so conjecture on his leaving may be quite pre-mature.
bobbbymax 12/5/2012 | 2:33:04 AM
re: Li Quits Procket BM sounds like he has an ego just like Tony Li's --- hmmm I wonder.... maybe BM really stands for bowel movement.

AGAIN

bobbbymax != BobbyMax

;-)
IP Observer 12/5/2012 | 2:33:07 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Actually rumor about Avici falling through floors was started by Juniper sales/SEs not LR although they chose to report it. I heard it often enough. It makes you wonder what other crap they're spreading. I'm ok with the occasional FUD since it is expected, but when it is an outright lie, it is pathetic.
Juniper is just as bad as Cisco ever us and they use same tactics.
answeris42 12/5/2012 | 2:33:07 AM
re: Li Quits Procket "BobbyMax's posts generate the most replies ........ any thread with maximim BM posts will invariably be the longest thread"

BM sounds like he has an ego just like Tony Li's --- hmmm I wonder.... maybe BM really stands for bowel movement.
change_is_good 12/5/2012 | 2:33:10 AM
re: Li Quits Procket dude, that avci box surely has its advantages over csco and jnpr.

too bad you can only sell $11M for Q4 and $39M for an entire year.

competing against avci is like betting if the sun is going to come up tomorrow. it's a no-brainer.
byteme3 12/5/2012 | 2:33:14 AM
re: Li Quits Procket >What I thought was funny was the "nail in the >coffin" comment from Avici. Isn't Avici a power >consuming, full rack, under featured, under >dense, non modular, over priced system that >falls thru floors? Ooops, maybe I am I talking >about the HFR.
-------------

Obviously you are a Juniper or Procket employee, and I will admit I work at Avici and feel compelled to correct your lack of knowledge. Procket does not make their docs public, so it is hard to know what they really do/don't do, so all I can go on is their data-sheets.

1) The Avici router consumes less power than the T640, M160, 12x00 or 8812 per ft. Per Gb the avici drawws less power than the m160, T640, and 12400, but on par with the 12800. the 8812 does best per Gb.
2) Avici has a quarter-rack mountable chassis (QSR), a half-rack mountable chassis (SSR), and a full 7-foot self-standing chassis (TSR). Juniper does not have a quarter-rack 192c-capable chassis. From what I can tell about procket, they do have an 8801 chassis which looks small, but since it has no redundancy I don't see how it's more than a lab system.
3) Obviously Avici has fewer features than Cisco or Juniper, as those companies build edge routers as well. But Avici only focuses on core features, and I think they do them very well.
4) Density? Avici's on par with the T-640 and blows away the 12816, but it's not about density anymore - it's about system scaling - getting rid of the "# of slots" limitation. None of those guys have shown that ability, whereas Avici has had it for years.
5) Non-modular? You must be behind a bit. Their architecture is very modular, but they don't let you upgrade a single software process as Procket claims to, if that's what you mean. Avici does let you do hitless software upgrades, though. (which Cisco and Juniper don't... yet) For what it's worth, I also think Procket's idea of per-process versioning is a horrible idea. It's virtually impossible to test/support all permutations thoroughly.
6) Over-priced? It's pricing is equal to Cisco/Juniper. (slightly less/more depending on config, as everyone is)
7) Falls through floors? That has actually never happened, although I think the rumor started on LR. For the record, the T640 and 8812 weigh the same as the Avici.
echo2 12/5/2012 | 2:33:14 AM
re: Li Quits Procket
Although the waste of bandwidth on the outsourcing may pass it, I think the current record is war, which ran for 2 months. Sorry to disapoint you guys that think Tony Li is God, or that Procket is that significant, but this thread wont touch any records, and is mostly already dead:

http://www.lightreading.com/bo...


My options will make me rich!
Echo2
null0 12/5/2012 | 2:33:17 AM
re: Li Quits Procket My guess is the thread with the most number of posts is Headcount: Offshoring, Dude!

Currently with 953 posts....

http://www.lightreading.com/bo...
edgesansonet 12/5/2012 | 2:33:21 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Know before you talk. The Juniper center was a silicon valley startup's india devel center. Dont know the name of that startup but I know for sure from sources it got acquired by Juniper after the startup got blown away. Now, I guess it is their devel/test center.
edgesansonet 12/5/2012 | 2:33:22 AM
re: Li Quits Procket metanoiac,
we can add tellabs to it too!!
ESS
bobbbymax 12/5/2012 | 2:33:22 AM
re: Li Quits Procket BobbyMax's posts generate the most replies ........ any thread with maximim BM posts will invariably be the longest thread
edgesansonet 12/5/2012 | 2:33:22 AM
re: Li Quits Procket May you should start one for Jasmine Networks and make it exceed 5000 posts! Sounds great to me...
john_chambers_assistant 12/5/2012 | 2:33:23 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Well let's see - 12 8812's = 480GB per chassis x 12 = 5760GB total.

With a 12416, 16 slots @ 10GB minus 2 for RP's = 14 x 10GB = 140GB per chassis. So 5760 / 140 = 41 12416 chassis to equal the capacity of 12 8812's.

You must have a really big power bill....

JC will love you when you upgrade to the 12816!


Hello, I be John Chambers personal assistant, ya may remember me from such quarterly reports an' Q2 '99, Q3 '97 an' mo' recently Q2 '00.

So me an' da big wig, JC wuz shooting da sheeit taday while cruising da strip looking fo' tricks an' we's started jivin'. And not yo' usual run o' da mill, whose banging who kind o' fly werd, we's wuz jivin' about da industry. Oh jaa, don' bring dat pimp sheeit in here dog.

So me an' JC iz jivin' about dis here here post an' we's feel da need ta educate all da motherfucking homeboys out dere who ain't got but half uh clue. What we's gots here iz what we's industry insiders like ta page "Procket Math". This iz not da "Cisco Math" dat ya iz taught in skoo an' all love. In da world o' procket math 1 iz 4 an' 2 iz 9 an' 7 iz 3. Shit iz not right. To make it simple uh homeboy be paying uh buck fiddy fo' his Glock wiff dis here sheeit.

So when dis here homeboy starts swapping "Procket Math" fo' "Cisco Math" he comes up wiff some radically different numbers, yo! 12 8812's- 1 HFR + change ta spare. And dat change ain't light, yo. It'sabout enough ta hook uh homeboy up wiff 2 years worth o' stash. Weed in da pipe iz worth mo' than uh bawx in da lab. You know das right!
edgesansonet 12/5/2012 | 2:33:23 AM
re: Li Quits Procket hubba hubba hubba
metanoiac 12/5/2012 | 2:33:24 AM
re: Li Quits Procket >>What 'topic' has had the most message posts
>>ever and 'how many' posts were recorded?

This topic is not even close either in total number or in longivity !!
See :
http://www.lightreading.com/do...
quokka 12/5/2012 | 2:33:25 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Yes, I guess it was the Australian version of DARPANet in the good old days. As the web page (www.aarnet.edu.au) says:
AARNet Pty Ltd (APL) is the company that operates Australia's Research and Education Network (AREN). It is a not-for-profit company limited by shares. The shareholders are 37 Australian universities and the CSIRO.

Carrier license 61. 800,000 end users. The aim seems to be to provide tails to these organisations at GbE and above. AARNet provides both commodity and R&E traffic to its users.

Mere small fry...
opticalwatcher 12/5/2012 | 2:33:26 AM
re: Li Quits Procket 'The Procket story mentions "8000-series" routers only, no type, no capacity."

The AARNET press release specifically mentions the 8812 routers.

As I asked before, isn't AARNET an Australian version of DARPANet? Doesn't a sigificant amount of Australian Internet traffic go through it? I may be wrong--but that is my impression. If it is true, then saying that it is for 'an Australian university' is a serious misunderstanding. Anyone from down-under that can clarify this?

Belzebutt 12/5/2012 | 2:33:27 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Well let's see - 12 8812's = 480GB per chassis x 12 = 5760GB total.

With a 12416, 16 slots @ 10GB minus 2 for RP's = 14 x 10GB = 140GB per chassis. So 5760 / 140 = 41 12416 chassis to equal the capacity of 12 8812's.


Hang on, why do you assume fully loaded 1/2 rack boxen?

The Procket story mentions "8000-series" routers only, no type, no capacity.

If you think a university needs and can afford 12 fully loaded core routers... we're talking a carrier's core network here, hundreds of companies and millions of consumers worth of traffic requiring that many boxes. An Australian university has no use for that amount of gear.
Mezo 12/5/2012 | 2:33:27 AM
re: Li Quits Procket LR,

What 'topic' has had the most message posts ever and 'how many' posts were recorded?

Thanks
Mezo 12/5/2012 | 2:33:29 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Considering the footprint of a GSR I'll bet you NEEDED a bigger test lab :]

Hey Belzebutt, thanks for your post...especially the second movie...it's just too funny.

May the force be with you...
signmeup 12/5/2012 | 2:33:30 AM
re: Li Quits Procket mboeing wrote:
I had GSR test labs bigger then that.

Well let's see - 12 8812's = 480GB per chassis x 12 = 5760GB total.

With a 12416, 16 slots @ 10GB minus 2 for RP's = 14 x 10GB = 140GB per chassis. So 5760 / 140 = 41 12416 chassis to equal the capacity of 12 8812's.

You must have a really big power bill....

JC will love you when you upgrade to the 12816!
mboeing 12/5/2012 | 2:33:33 AM
re: Li Quits Procket <quote>
If you read the press release, it clearly states that this is not a 1 or 2 box deal. More like 12. AARNET is a very large backbone, and it is a significant win for Procket
</quote>

I had GSR test labs bigger then that.
null0 12/5/2012 | 2:33:37 AM
re: Li Quits Procket "From what I know of Tony ( mostly nanog meetings) he is a straight shooter and very approachable. An engineer's engineer."

They rarely (and never in isolation) build a successful & profitable company....

Maybe someone should let the guys who are half as good as he get on with what they are paid to provide and if all is said and done and everything is as true as the rumors suggest Procket should walk this mile of discontent and still win.

What is that saying again?
In the land of the blind the one eyed man is King? Maybe its time one of the blind poked the king in the eye..........

Null
zher 12/5/2012 | 2:33:39 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Totally agreed.
dash_riprock 12/5/2012 | 2:33:42 AM
re: Li Quits Procket
From what I know of Tony ( mostly nanog meetings) he is a straight shooter and very approachable.
An engineer's engineer.





truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:33:49 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Sadly there's a con that goes on by any management and that is to motivate the troops in godd and bad times.

The amount of BS and its "quality" is directly proportional to the real experience of the manager.
routethus 12/5/2012 | 2:33:49 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Let's face it. Tony was a figure head at Procket. For much of the time he was managing the driver group - it wasn't as if he was crunching heavy-duty BGP code.

Many operators respect Tony and he is definitely valuable from that perspective, I guess the Investors believe they get that with Roland; though not sure it is an apples to apples swap.

If I was a procket fan I'd be more worried about some of the teething problems WRT the technology than anything Tony does or doesn't do. It is great to build a fast machine, but it has to fast under all conditions - Procket has some interesting design issues here. Also for the largest carriers (perhaps a small number admittedly) the lack of a cluster solution is a problem.

So if Procket fails from here, it is not because Tony left, it is because being another Juniper is ultimately not that compelling - being another Juniper with technical clitches and no clustering solution is even less so. I'd be more worried about that than anything else.....
john_chambers_assistant 12/5/2012 | 2:33:49 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Hello, I be John Chambers personal assistant, ya may remember me from such strategic acquisitions as Cerent, Stratacom, an' recently Hammerhead networks.

First o' all, I'd like ta send uh shout out ta all muh ma fukin peeps on Sand Hill cruize. Fo' Shizzle ma nizzle homes. Keepin' it real up in Menlo Park. Fo evuh.

Second, I gots some exciting news fo' all da tasty little peeps out dere. We iz increasing our investment in Procket, ta 99.9% o' Procket. For me ta poop on. We iz purchasing all o' procket except da following assets: a) da stack o' 38,000 unused "Inspected By Tony Li" stickers b) da procket fish. We don' need fish, we's iz not uh fish company, fish iz not our culture. Repeat 5 times, rinse an' lather. As part o' dis here deal we's will also port da BSD procket layer ta an internet enabled toaster over near ya.

All yo' routing update iz belong ta us!

Roland thought he could just slip away from us without paying up da office NFL pool. Tisk Tisk, silly Roland, since ya stiffed us on dat $50 ya will git dat crappy office in da basement o' Building 10 where da air conditioning don' werk, an' da wall vibrates whenever someone flushes da toilet. You will return da stapler as well! Cough up da dough dammit.

All yo' BGP iz converge on Tasman.

Embrace yo' new networking overlords! Bow down 'bfoe thy diety IOS!
rocksolid 12/5/2012 | 2:33:52 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Manybe Tony is a "thinker" that can "do"....

Scooby-dooby-dooo
mc-photon 12/5/2012 | 2:33:52 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Every well staffed start-up has many "doers" for eery "thinker". At the end of the day, the "doing" is more important that teh "thinking" in order to get the product outta the door.
WiserNow 12/5/2012 | 2:33:52 AM
re: Li Quits Procket "There are many extremely talented people working at Procket.... These people are the ones that will make Procket successful, not as individuals, but as a team."

Procket snapped up Ascend experienced talent. Cary Hayward, the marketing guy as well as Stuart Monks, the software guy come from Ascend. They know how to make products work.

With luck, Procket will steal marketshare from Cisco. Certainly, Cisco is leaving room for competition to leapfrog them.

Datacomm needs fresh blood. I hope Procket can provide it.
piltdownman 12/5/2012 | 2:33:53 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Wouldn't ATM interfaces just be OC-3, OC-12 and OC-48 just like POS interfaces?
mc-photon 12/5/2012 | 2:33:53 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Executives will BS their staff all the time. That is a pre-requisite for the job. Acra is probably no different.
3e8 12/5/2012 | 2:33:53 AM
re: Li Quits Procket every start-up with a hot box is a competitor to Cisco. Juniper had 0.01% market share when they started too....
mc-photon 12/5/2012 | 2:33:54 AM
re: Li Quits Procket 3e8,

How can you call Procket a competitor to Cisco?

Cisco has like 60-70% market share in core routing. Procket now has like 0.01%.

Frabkly Cisco probably doesn't care about Procket and Tony Li.
3e8 12/5/2012 | 2:33:54 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Actually reading through Cisco was an investor when Procket was a chip company....so I guess they'd be happy to see them fail now that they are a competitor.
3e8 12/5/2012 | 2:33:55 AM
re: Li Quits Procket If Cisco is an investor and therefore a future potential acquirer or Procket wouldn't they be very concerned if Tony Li was quiting as this might affect the product design?
rocksolid 12/5/2012 | 2:33:55 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Sisyphus,

I am not sure what you are alluding to. Who is the "big public company"?
rocksolid 12/5/2012 | 2:33:55 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Sorry for triple posting back there - sticky fingers
reoptic 12/5/2012 | 2:33:56 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Q. It has been reported that one of the challenges internally at Procket is in working with the founders, including Chief Scientist Tony Li. How closely did you work with Li when the two of you were at Cisco?

Acra: I worked with him a lot back when I was with Cisco in Europe. I was building the technical field organization at the time. So I was facing the customers, designing IP backbones and [Border Gateway Protocol] routing designs, and Tony would be one of the guys who would be, despite nine hours of difference, on his e-mail answering my questions and helping me through it. We stayed great friends since then and he was, by the way, one of the initial folks who felt me out and approached me about Procket to see if I was interested. I'm very excited to be back working with him.


oc-infinity 12/5/2012 | 2:33:56 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Does anybody know over which vendor's WDM or SDH systems the Procket deployment in Australia will be carried?

Is it over leased wavelengths from Telstra or Optus, or is their customer also deploying an optical backbone?
mc-photon 12/5/2012 | 2:33:57 AM
re: Li Quits Procket I read that Cisco was an investor in Procket. Why would they do that if Procket is building a competitive box to the GSR?
rocksolid 12/5/2012 | 2:33:57 AM
re: Li Quits Procket What is the relevance of Procket not having ATM interfaces?
rocksolid 12/5/2012 | 2:33:57 AM
re: Li Quits Procket What is the relevance of Procket not having ATM interfaces?
rocksolid 12/5/2012 | 2:33:58 AM
re: Li Quits Procket What is the relevance of Procket not having ATM interfaces?
BluMountain 12/5/2012 | 2:33:58 AM
re: Li Quits Procket First off I'll admit that I am a Juniper fan and customer, but what I have seen at NANOG and Scinet give me grudging respect for Procket's products. With or without Tony they have something interesting and real.

What I thought was funny was the "nail in the coffin" comment from Avici. Isn't Avici a power consuming, full rack, under featured, under dense, non modular, over priced system that falls thru floors? Ooops, maybe I am I talking about the HFR.
tekweeny 12/5/2012 | 2:33:59 AM
re: Li Quits Procket ...it's interesting to see how moist people seem to be missing the real story here... perhaps in some way connected to a big public company and some executive leaving in good or bad terms and the issues that might have caused... and others' reaction... enough said...

Forget to take your lithium today?
Sisyphus 12/5/2012 | 2:33:59 AM
re: Li Quits Procket
...it's interesting to see how moist people seem to be missing the real story here... perhaps in some way connected to a big public company and some executive leaving in good or bad terms and the issues that might have caused... and others' reaction... enough said...
5urf5hop 12/5/2012 | 2:34:01 AM
re: Li Quits Procket http://www.fanta.dk/showmovie....

... it's all about the preferences
zillionaire 12/5/2012 | 2:34:05 AM
re: Li Quits Procket that is the best - India is even stealing our comedy films now.
bmedwar 12/5/2012 | 2:34:05 AM
re: Li Quits Procket I worked at Juniper and the list of incredible individuals is long (Dave Katz, Dennis Ferguson, Tom Pusateri, Manoj L., Bruce Cole, Steve Lin, Kompella, Andy Heffernan) and that is just the protocol developers and only those that I had direct interaction with. Most of these guys didn't have big egos, although they were very busy people, so you had better have your sh1t straight and have RTFM before you go to them for info. From what I understand getting rid of Tony Li was the best thing to happen to them. They certainly didn't seem to miss him.
5urf5hop 12/5/2012 | 2:34:06 AM
re: Li Quits Procket >How is going from 32 OC-192s in a 1/2 rack
>to 48 a "quantum leap"?

I pitty the man who has to ask that question.

Output striping and cell switching via high speek serial link interconnects rules!
andropat 12/5/2012 | 2:34:07 AM
re: Li Quits Procket byteme3,

you are correct in stating that many rfp's are written with a bias towards technology or vendor of choice and you are also right in saying it typically weighs in criscos favor.

I must add, however, that at the end of the day "technologies" were tested rigorously over many days. It doesn't matter how an rfp is written when at the end of the day you test two systems for igp/bgp scaling, convergence, etc., These are just straightforward tests and the results were not even comparable.

If they were we may have seen at least some hybrid win where cisco won edge/juniper core or vice versa or half and half in each role. That was not the case.

pat
andropat 12/5/2012 | 2:34:07 AM
re: Li Quits Procket wilecoyote,

It is so refreshing to hear the facts. You are right on and absolutely know what you are talking about. If I had to choose whether to have Katz by my side or Li by my side... no contest!

Katz is in my opinion the best in the industry. He says it like it is.. he has a wealth of real-world experience and knowledge... can talk to customers, etc., etc., And best of all..has no ego.

pat
uno04 12/5/2012 | 2:34:09 AM
re: Li Quits Procket
So signmeup and wilecoyote work for Procket and hope that Tony Li leaving will not have an impact on Procket. Good luck guys!
Belzebutt 12/5/2012 | 2:34:10 AM
re: Li Quits Procket It is Bill Lynch's circuits that make the quantum leap in forwarding performance possible.


How is going from 32 OC-192s in a 1/2 rack to 48 a "quantum leap"?
5urf5hop 12/5/2012 | 2:34:11 AM
re: Li Quits Procket >You wanna know who the real stud is at Procket?
>Bill Lynch, the Sun guy. He is CTO for a reason.

well said wilecoyote

Procket's family jewels are its chip-driver libraries that communicate with and manage the Procket designed integrated circuits in the system. It is Bill Lynch's circuits that make the quantum leap in forwarding performance possible.

Routing and MPLS design is fast becoming a commodity. Much of it is being outsourced to India.
byteme3 12/5/2012 | 2:34:13 AM
re: Li Quits Procket >Are you suggesting the Gig-be win by juniper was >not scrutinized and/or evaluated in nearly the >same fashion?
--------------------------

I don't doubt the gov tech guys fealt it was an honest eval, and I don't doubt that Juniper has a fine router for their application. But did you read the Gig-be RFP? It was written for Juniper in terms of features and design. I'm surprised it didn't say "Your product name must begin with an 'M' or 'T'". It was a done deal before any testing began, imho.

Not that that's a bad thing - it's the best way to sell and is a testament to their federal sales guys. (and it happens in many RFPs, although usually in Cisco's favor) Just don't think it was an objective contest.
signmeup 12/5/2012 | 2:34:14 AM
re: Li Quits Procket "that a house built upon a single stone will surely crumble; but a house built upon the backs of many stones will last forever."

There are many extremely talented people working at Procket. A good number of them were in the industry long before Tony arrived, and have contributed much to this industry. These people are the ones that will make Procket successful, not as individuals, but as a team.
signmeup 12/5/2012 | 2:34:16 AM
re: Li Quits Procket wilecoyote,

Well said! Probably the most accurate description of the situation so far on the boards.

AAL6 12/5/2012 | 2:34:17 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Sure he is.
As much as Jeanette Symons is ;-)




NOT!!!
reoptic 12/5/2012 | 2:34:17 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Looking back appears Randall had it right when he wanted to sell to Alcatel. At the time Tony blocked the move and Randall and head of sales and marketing left in wake. Now Tony is out the door along with the CFO (can you say management turnover) and there is no buyer in sight. Meanwhile tens of millions more cash is gone and Procket still a long way from a viable business model. This is a really bad blunder on the part of the venture investors. It doesn't help our overall vc community when execution happens this way, to say nothing of investors or employees.

People used to say don't worry about Procket, because they have Tony Li. Now they have no Tony, no business, and cash running out. Time to worry.
wilecoyote 12/5/2012 | 2:34:17 AM
re: Li Quits Procket I have to point out that Dave Katz re-wrote almost all of Tony's code at Juniper. Fact. Ponder that for awhile, folks. Tony was demoted at Juniper which is why he quit. He whined. They laughed. They're laughing now. Dave Katz=cool. Tony=notascoolasyouthink. BASIC.

He later got demoted at Procket and quit. When no one chased after him, he came crawling back. Now he's quitting because one of his buddies is quitting and the guys at Procket are now laughing because they got rid of two egomaniacs at the same time without lifting a finger.

I fuc_king hate egomaniacs. Especially when they have far less talent that they think. You wanna know who the real stud is at Procket? Bill Lynch, the Sun guy. He is CTO for a reason. There's a class guy with real talent who understands his role in the universe.

So the real stud story at Juniper is Dave Katz, not Tony and not Yakov. Yakov came way after they introduced the M. The real story at Procket is what the new CEO does with a new bag of money, a new customer win and one less headache. Let's wait and see what happens before equating Tony's departure with failure and doom for a suddenly very promising startup.
tiredofyouwhiners 12/5/2012 | 2:34:18 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Please stop! Us lurkers are getting all wet from you people peeing all over each other.

I'm moving over to the offshoring discussions for more abuse.

toyw
echo2 12/5/2012 | 2:34:18 AM
re: Li Quits Procket I am sure their fate is sealed, but I am not sure if it is a heavenly or hellish fate. Either they are being acquired and Tony is off to his next gig, or the management cracks have penetrated the foundation and Procket is collapsing in on itself.

Either way, my options are going to make me rich!

Echo2

andropat 12/5/2012 | 2:34:20 AM
re: Li Quits Procket dorknumber3,

I said they needed to win a deal... one that is significant. One that means if there boxes cause trouble they will end up on these message boards. I also said I had no doubt that Tonys name and contacts and reputation would get his boxes deployed. And I was right... he is in Australia "personally".

I then stated that I did not consider the deployment of boxes into this network "significant". Do you? I want to see them deployed in a major role in a network that will depend on their systems stability and performance or lost revenues will result.

pat
Neophone 12/5/2012 | 2:34:22 AM
re: Li Quits Procket I just want to introduce Procket into China
one of most important carrier. they also respect
tony li when learn about what he have done.

so sorry he left so fast!
PO 12/5/2012 | 2:34:24 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Wherever Tony goes next, I have no doubt things will go well. I'm not saying he's Midas, but he does know his game and he plays it very well.

I wish I had the pleasure of working closely with more such talented people. Unfortunately, as easy as it is to pick on anyone -- and people have taken more than a few shots at him -- there are too few of Tony's calibre.

And no, Tony doesn't know me: we've never met, we've never worked together. I'm not applying for any jobs working with him. But I do have a lot of respect for what he has contributed to our Industry, and I hope he continues to actively participate as he finds his new feet.

(On the other hand, our industry does have a lot of depth, as evidenced by those who have indicated that they have better information than does the United Nations. But that's on an old thread.)

Cheers, Tony!
edgesansonet 12/5/2012 | 2:34:24 AM
re: Li Quits Procket signmeup:
You dont need to. It is a good place for your egghead. :)
ESS



>>>>

andropat,

If you read the press release...................
................................................
I'll pull my head out of your ass as soon as you say something that makes sense.

light-headed 12/5/2012 | 2:34:26 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Tony Li got his fame for not just writing specs and RFCs, but also implementing them, he wrote the code himself, and design system arch. This differentiates him from a lot of other guys, especially Radia Perlman, Dave Katz, Paul Traina, Yakov Rekhter. (John Moy, Ross Callon are pretty hands on as well). People who worked with Tony at Cisco/Juniper do think he is devine, for a reason. That is why Tony is the type of guy a startup needs, and he attracts venture investment.
------------------------------------------------


Indy Light,

Get your head out of your ass, Radia helped code and design 802.1d STP, Novell NLSP and ISIS at DEC. Dave Katz and Paul Traina are two of the best network/IP developers in the world and did a lot of heavy lifting at both early Cisco and Juniper. Yakov has always been more of an R&D guy and a professor but get it right about these others. I wouldn't have a job without their and Tony's work and I have a tons of respect for all of them.

ps - Nobody seems to have addressed the possible real issue Tony might be pissed and leaving. I suspect it is because the investors want to wash out on this new round. From what i hear the previous 242M funding/1.3B value round had about 30-35M of the employees own money in it and not just people like Tony Li. A washout or serious dilution will hurt a lot of people and not just people with Cisco/Juniper money. Maybe Tony is just standing up for his friends and co-workers who believed in him and are looking at losing a substantial amount. Just my .02
stonerocks 12/5/2012 | 2:34:27 AM
re: Li Quits Procket >He is leaving because PROCKET is going to have a large
>lay-off and he was asked to choice/name only the best.
>The engineers will be hit the most as they ramp for sales
>and operations.

Wow, now I know how rumor gets created...

Truelight, how did you know? Did Tony personally tell you?

Stonerocks
truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:34:28 AM
re: Li Quits Procket He is leaving because PROCKET is going to have a large lay-off and he was asked to choice/name only the best. The engineers will be hit the most as they ramp for sales and operations.

Indy_lite 12/5/2012 | 2:34:29 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Juniper went IPO after about 4 years of existence. Procket was founded in summer of 99, so it will be 5 years in a few months, don't see any IPO in sight yet.

Li worked for Juniper for 3 1/2 years, Procket for 4 years already. He worked for Cisco a little longer - 6 years ?
doornumber3 12/5/2012 | 2:34:30 AM
re: Li Quits Procket "12 boxes... WOW! You are right man this is a "significant" win for procket. My bad for sure. I didn't realize the size and complexity of this win. They are IPOing for sure now.

pat"


OK, we get it. You don't like Procket and never will. You discount them for not getting deals and them discount them when they do get deals. Give it a break or find something new to talk about. Nobody knows how Procket will come out of this, but you insisting they get a deal to be legit and then ignoring the deal they did get is just ridiculous.

3
reflection 12/5/2012 | 2:34:31 AM
re: Li Quits Procket "Tony Li got his fame for not just writing specs and RFCs, but also implementing them, he wrote the code himself, and design system arch. This differentiates him from a lot of other guys, especially Radia Perlman, Dave Katz, Paul Traina, Yakov Rekhter. (John Moy, Ross Callon are pretty hands on as well). People who worked with Tony at Cisco/Juniper do think he is devine, for a reason. That is why Tony is the type of guy a startup needs, and he attracts venture investment."

P-leease! Katz and Traina actively wrote code in their day. Now they have their own airplanes and multiple estates... they don't need to write anything anymore. Perlman created IS-IS. Rekhter authored BGP while Li was still wet behind the ears. Others like Cerf/Kahn created TCP/IP. You can't downplay the these and many others. Architecture/design of protocols is much more visionary/harder than the mere coding of them.
dellman 12/5/2012 | 2:34:32 AM
re: Li Quits Procket By various accounts, procket seems to have a working router with POS and Ethernet interfaces; Most of the must have IP/MPLS features have been implemented. IMO,Procket needs to support more types of interfaces - ATM, channelized interfaces(OC48/OC12). As a short term strategy, they can partner with Laurel networks to provide edge/core IP solutions.
If Cisco HFR gets into serious trouble, they could be interested in Procket box. I guess the new CEO is thinking in these lines ( he should know what cisco lacks!) and this might have been the cause for Tony Li's departure.
truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:34:33 AM
re: Li Quits Procket My kinda startup guy send me his email address.
Need more like him in the industry.

DocGonzo 12/5/2012 | 2:34:34 AM
re: Li Quits Procket "Tony Li got his fame for not just writing specs and RFCs, but also implementing them, he wrote the code himself, and design system arch. This differentiates him from a lot of other guys, especially Radia Perlman, Dave Katz, Paul Traina, Yakov Rekhter. (John Moy, Ross Callon are pretty hands on as well). People who worked with Tony at Cisco/Juniper do think he is devine, for a reason. That is why Tony is the type of guy a startup needs, and he attracts venture investment."

I think you are being unfair to a lot of these other people. Many of them (and unnamed others) have actually written code and contributed to design specs. Tony is one of several talented engineers in this industry, but he happens to have personal visibility beyond others for obvious reasons. He is not a deity and has some self-evident shortcomings as well. His contributions at all three companies have been significant, but not irreplacable. Just as the ripples in a pond created by a splash, this too will dissipate with time.

Doc
tekweeny 12/5/2012 | 2:34:34 AM
re: Li Quits Procket If he has a big shlong, sure.


-Peter Little
Indy_lite 12/5/2012 | 2:34:35 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Tony Li got his fame for not just writing specs and RFCs, but also implementing them, he wrote the code himself, and design system arch. This differentiates him from a lot of other guys, especially Radia Perlman, Dave Katz, Paul Traina, Yakov Rekhter. (John Moy, Ross Callon are pretty hands on as well). People who worked with Tony at Cisco/Juniper do think he is devine, for a reason. That is why Tony is the type of guy a startup needs, and he attracts venture investment.
reflection 12/5/2012 | 2:34:37 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Of course not! But the way people here talk about him and how he's portrayed in the press releases sure make it sound like he's devine. He is a great figurehead for getting press coverage and funding, but as far as being technical, there are many who are in the same league. Radia Perlman, Dave Katz, Paul Traina, Yakov Rekhter, John Moy, Ross Callon, just to name a few. There are many more unsung heroes who do are just as good as Li but do not get the publicity.

Tony, please chime in and give credit to the other folks where credit is due.
tekweeny 12/5/2012 | 2:34:38 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Procket sucks without Tony Li or is that Tommy Lee

When does the video come out? We can see if Tony has as big a shlong as Tommy!
ATMRules 12/5/2012 | 2:34:38 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Well, everybody says, Tony this, Toni that, I guess the networking world will never be the same w/out Mr Li, everybody's acting like he was the first one on top of the mountain with a blanket and a fire using smoke signals, like he's the god of data communications, I bet he's getting his jollies off just reading about himself, tomorrow is another day and the sun will rise and all that stuff, good luck to Toni if wants to quit, we all quit, get fired or retire eventually...just my two cents...

ATMRules....
andropat 12/5/2012 | 2:34:39 AM
re: Li Quits Procket 12 boxes... WOW! You are right man this is a "significant" win for procket. My bad for sure. I didn't realize the size and complexity of this win. They are IPOing for sure now.

pat
signmeup 12/5/2012 | 2:34:40 AM
re: Li Quits Procket andropat,

If you read the press release, it clearly states that this is not a 1 or 2 box deal. More like 12. AARNET is a very large backbone, and it is a significant win for Procket.

http://australianit.com.au/art...

I'll pull my head out of your ass as soon as you say something that makes sense.

truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:34:40 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Okay lets take Tony back and fire all the backstabbers. Lets get ride of the new CEO as well.

BTW Tony I will be sending my resume in once your at the helm.
truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:34:40 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Leave "I IPO'ed" alone

Procket sucks without Tony Li or is that Tommy Lee ;-)


opticalwatcher 12/5/2012 | 2:34:41 AM
re: Li Quits Procket "a win does not mean some educational account in australia who may need 1 or 2 boxes and Tonys signature."

I wouldn't call AARNET a mere 'education account'!
Isn't it the Australian equivalent of DARPAnet?
andropat 12/5/2012 | 2:34:41 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Actually very well said. You are right. Juniper is okay without tony and procket will probably be better.

Is FW23 posting under a different name all of a sudden? :-)

andropat 12/5/2012 | 2:34:41 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Mezo,

I guess to someone like yourself still hoping for the big payday with your "options" I am a wiener or whiner as you put it.

If those are procket options you are holding good luck my dear friend.. good luck!

pat
andropat 12/5/2012 | 2:34:43 AM
re: Li Quits Procket signmeup,

Read it again. I specifically said procket did NOT bid and I wish they had bid so their system could have been tested as well. Get your head out of their ass and read stuff correctly before responding. I did say they need a "win" and I simply reemphasized it again today by saying a win does not mean some educational account in australia who may need 1 or 2 boxes and Tonys signature.

i am biased. thank you.

Pat
edgesansonet 12/5/2012 | 2:34:43 AM
re: Li Quits Procket lipoed,
You are insulting vending machine engineers. Actually, Bobbymax ate beef with mad cow disease 4 years ago. The virus got to him now. Imagine a human with bores in his brain. Yes..you got it..that is Bobbymax.
TM
Hey..."All your base are belong to us" Gea !!! Where are you?
ESS
>>
lipoed: another ridiculous statement from the vending machine engineer

SoapOperaFan 12/5/2012 | 2:34:43 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Perhaps Mr. Li meant to evoke Nixon's famous Checkers speech, ("you won't have Tony Li to kick around anymore"), but managed to conjure up LBJ instead ("tonight I come to you with a heavy heart").
What's next, MLK (I HAD a dream..)? Shakespeare ("now is the winter of my discontent")?

Put down Bartlett's Quotations and start to worry about how your hissy fit is affecting the livelihood of your fellow members of "the best team I have ever worked with" who don't have your big bucks to stomp off the playground everytime you don't get to be cookie monitor.

BTW, this is more amusing than General Hospital.
truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:34:45 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Kinda like "prima donnas" myself they get things done !

Versus the rest of the wannabee crowd who tend to slow things up to a fault and then try and blame those that are trying.

Power to Tony Li and his clan - Procket without a socket !
truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:34:45 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Send my resume off I expect a reply soon ;-)
digerato 12/5/2012 | 2:34:46 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Tony is very bright and knows everything there is to know about BGP. He also has an overdeveloped sense of his own self and a lack of emotional maturity. And he's a drama queen (e.g. that line about "the alternative is far worse")

Sadly, he is far from alone in having these qualities -- you find them at lots of silly valley venture-funded start-ups. However, he's been allowed by the VCs to get away with the typical prima donna "if you don't do it my way I'm resigning" BS sooooo many times.

So, for what it's worth, my hat is off to Roland for not putting up with that kind of behavior and having the board back him up.

The last two companies that suffered Tony's tantrums and, final dramatic departure are both doing rather well, so I seriously doubt this is the end of the world for Procket. In fact, it might dramatically improve the working environment there.

Digerato
vapa 12/5/2012 | 2:34:47 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Can some one post it so I can send him my resume for his next gig.

http://www-ucs.usc.edu/~tli/

:)
truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:34:48 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Can some one post it so I can send him my resume for his next gig.
Mezo 12/5/2012 | 2:34:49 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Bravo signmeup...bravo...

It's so easy to track habitual whiners like androgynous Pat...or should I say wieners...

And even BobbyMaxipad said something nice...

Yeah, the market has returned! My options will make me rich...always liked that one :]

Bet me that this will be the longest message string ever...when Ghost started talking about apes and tar...well let's just say it's getting kooky on LR.

I think your right on GIG-BE they were looking for a big brother or something for that one at Supercom...must not have found one.
signmeup 12/5/2012 | 2:34:50 AM
re: Li Quits Procket andropat,

You are incorrect. Procket did NOT bid on the Gig-be deal. Try to spin it any way you want, people in the know will see you for what you are..

Just last week you were saying "Procket has to win a deal before they can be a serious contender....", So now they have and you change your story to say "Procket has to win the core of a carrier before they can be a serious contender.."

Pretty soon you'll be saying "Procket has to win the core of a carrier in the U.S. who isn't bankrupt, doesn't have any executives under investigation, who is ripping out their entire infrastucture, and did it without Tony Li..."

It's pathetic how biased you are.
gotman 12/5/2012 | 2:34:50 AM
re: Li Quits Procket The only reason procket won AARNET is linerate IPv6. The AARNET engineers wouldn't know what a router is if it hit them in the face. They are really of poor quality yet very demanding and arrogant. I can't imagine them putting a test plan together. No wonder they needs Tony's help. Tony will tell us all about it once he surfaces from down under.

gm
Iipoed 12/5/2012 | 2:34:53 AM
re: Li Quits Procket another ridiculous statement from the vending machine engineer.
andropat 12/5/2012 | 2:34:53 AM
re: Li Quits Procket BM,

Are you suggesting the Gig-be win by juniper was not scrutinized and/or evaluated in nearly the same fashion? Be careful of your response because I know much my friend of the way junipers routers were evaluated "and ciscos" for that matter and am curious to see how credible your information is. This was a huge and rigorous eval and I honestly with procket was involved.

There is a very big difference getting routers deployed by people who make a living using them versus by people who simply use them for everyday communication needs. Juniper and cisco are in the cores of carriers networks because they make money "and that is questionable" on these routers by billing for a service. Let's see procket win these first before we start getting to excited... especially about educational networks. Not undermining the talent that exists in this community but the way products are used is a different story and ballgame.

pat
BobbyMax 12/5/2012 | 2:34:55 AM
re: Li Quits Procket First of all being selected by Australia's Academic and Research Network (AARNet) is no small feat. First the product evaluation was done by a group of well educated people who could not have neen influenced Cisco and Juniper. The underlying message behind this succeess is "Fair and Rigorous Evaluation". The Cisco and Juniper products have not undergone the same product scrunity. They win their contracts trough other questionable means.

Procket will survive the resignation of Tony Li. It is not clear at this time if he indeed has resigned.
lurker 12/5/2012 | 2:34:58 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Thanks cyber_techy. ;) Note I posted 45s before the story was updated!

I'd like to know more about Tony's comment - what is the alternative that is worse to letting his employees down?

Meanwhile, evidence is piling up that Li is not long for Procket. "I will continue with my 'tour of duty' here in Australia, but will be leaving the company after that," Li wrote in a note to fellow Procket employees, according to one Light Reading source. "I do not like letting you down, but the alternative to doing so is far worse. I cannot go into it further, I just hope you will trust me when I say that there are some things that a man has to do if he wants to retain his basic ethics and morals."

-l
freetrader 12/5/2012 | 2:34:59 AM
re: Li Quits Procket did the incoming ceo know when he took this job that li was leaving? did the investors know? ( is this what the lawyers call material?)did the latest customer know as it might change ones perception of the stability of the company? can procket now implement mpls or is that still a nono? how long till dino leaves? are any of these questions meaningful?
cyber_techy 12/5/2012 | 2:34:59 AM
re: Li Quits Procket
Rumor has it that the CFO "left" too. Can anyone confirm?

====================================================

yes
lurker 12/5/2012 | 2:35:00 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Rumor has it that the CFO "left" too. Can anyone confirm?

Hanover_Fist 12/5/2012 | 2:35:01 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Why would Cisco buy Procket for $$$ when they can pick it up for free?
andropat 12/5/2012 | 2:35:01 AM
re: Li Quits Procket ragnar,

Second comment that was right on. The only thing I hope is that he didn't leave because of a buyout. Because then he still had something to do with it becoming some semblance of successful. He left Juniper and look at that company.

He leaves procket and cisco or someone buys them at an overvalued price. I just want this company to GO AWAY!!! Industry doesn't need it.

pat
truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:35:02 AM
re: Li Quits Procket The CEO is a 'johhny come lately" - witha wide smile he is going to screw Procket and all that sit in her. You will all see.....how it is done.

truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:35:02 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Sounds like my kind of guy - let us know what he is doing next and I'll join him ;-)

andropat 12/5/2012 | 2:35:02 AM
re: Li Quits Procket This could not be better news! I have said for ages that this whole company was based solely on Tonys name. He is a big cry baby...always has been and always will be.

poor little FW23 pounding sand that his boyfriend left procket.

the timing is interesting as well. I just read an article with an interview of their new ceo stating he came to procket among other things because of tonys reputation and his relationship, etc.,

Maybe Tony got sick of traveling to all those customer trials he spoke so highly of recently :-)

pat
routethus 12/5/2012 | 2:35:03 AM
re: Li Quits Procket >> VC investors and marketing people did all the could to encourage this perception <<

Reoptics, you are nuts if you think the marketing people at Procket had anything to do with anything at procket. This was a land ruled by a king. Remember, Tony appointed himself product manager internally and CMO externally.
Indy_lite 12/5/2012 | 2:35:04 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Any comments ?
ragnar 12/5/2012 | 2:35:04 AM
re: Li Quits Procket It means the ship is sinking and of course, because it can't be Tony's fault, he runs away and can blame the new management when it augers into the bottom of the sea!

Hanover_Fist 12/5/2012 | 2:35:04 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Changes at Procket of this magnitude are normal...look around the industry and you will see this happening every day.

During the Internet gold rush, life was good (no need to show product/profits/business plan/etc...), only hype mattered.

Bubble pops, and lo and behold, there's nothing to show for all the expense (surprise).

Solution: change of management required...which angers original founding team.

Action: new management implement a new regime, alienating the founding team further.

Reccomendation: founding team is the problem...force them to resign or suffer the ridicule of being fired.

I guess Tony finally realized that Procket wasn't going to deliver on the original promised nirvana.
Mezo 12/5/2012 | 2:35:05 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Ok, so fw23 your too close based on your comments to be any more than a disgruntled employee.

Ghost, you need to cut back on the crack smoking...it's effecting your work...

Reoptic, angry at Procket...why? Whenever there's an article about Procket you gloom and doom...I think I've commented before that either you are or belong in Cisco marketing...

As for Tony, wish him well...this is just natural evolution of a start-up moving to operations...I do agree that he is part of Procket's DNA...I'll bet there is still a lot of talent doing the work.

Maybe he left because they finally won a customer of size and can survive this action...still doesn't really make sense...ok, Ghost pass the pipe...
holden_caufield 12/5/2012 | 2:35:06 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Wouldn't it make sense that Tony Li is only leaving post-funding round to ensure Procket's valuation stayed high(er) while they obtained funding? Maybe he anticipates this is Procket's last round anyway, so it doesn't make a difference in terms. After all, from now on out, it's revenues/cash flow that will make a valuation, not one guy.

He's probably fully vested at this point.

Holden
reoptic 12/5/2012 | 2:35:06 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Rarely has one individual been so tied up in the perceived brand and value of a company as Toni Li was with Procket. The VC investors and marketing people did all the could to encourage this perception. Therefore , this is the equivalent of a massive heart attack. A sudden and unrecoverable blow. The brand is crushed. If the investors have any kind of way to recover their funds, they will and the company will cease to exist quickly. A new case study in how not to market and manage a high tech company has been written.
sjd6 12/5/2012 | 2:35:06 AM
re: Li Quits Procket I don't know if you can put a number on it, but at least to me it drops the valuation a lot. I am wondering what the hell is going on over there?
Belzebutt 12/5/2012 | 2:35:09 AM
re: Li Quits Procket How much do you figure Procket's valuation has just dropped because of this?
diag_eng 12/5/2012 | 2:35:13 AM
re: Li Quits Procket This guy is incredible. Can't he finish anything? Talk about ADHD!

cyber_techy 12/5/2012 | 2:35:14 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Light Reading will update this story as more details are verified.
====================================================

Light Reading never bothered to verify stories before. Why this time?
willrouteforfood 12/5/2012 | 2:35:16 AM
re: Li Quits Procket fw,
is it 100 feet, or 100 meters on the restraining order?

(Nobody make any sudden moves) ;)

WRFF
Cybernetic_Ghost_Of_Chirstmas_ 12/5/2012 | 2:35:17 AM
re: Li Quits Procket He did not nail it to the door. But he did write it in elf blood. And there were many robots at the quickening.

So says:

The Cybernetic Ghost of Christmas Past from the Future
particle_man 12/5/2012 | 2:35:20 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Did he nail his resignation notice to the door?
DocGonzo 12/5/2012 | 2:35:20 AM
re: Li Quits Procket fw23:

Relax, it is not the end of the world. Maybe Tony decided to back away from it. In any case, go home early, take a few midol and crawl into bed with some heating pads. Tomorrow will bring another day of hope.

Doc
Cybernetic_Ghost_Of_Chirstmas_ 12/5/2012 | 2:35:21 AM
re: Li Quits Procket No.

I do not see this in his future which is the
past to me. The King of the tarpit will have
total control over any new venture he chooses
to associate his name with.

So Says:

The Cybernetic Ghost of Christmas Past From the Future.
Cybernetic_Ghost_Of_Chirstmas_ 12/5/2012 | 2:35:22 AM
re: Li Quits Procket
Thousands of years ago, Australia was run by apes who threw bones at
each other. One day, a magic man from the
tarpits of procket came to Australia and told
the apes that he would provide them with free
metal boxes to throw at each other and waste
upon. The apes agreed.

And so, the apes of australia took to throwing
metal boxes at each other and things were good.

But many were left to wonder how the tarpit could
do the dance of dollars if it gave away away
its metal boxes for free.

So says

The Ghost of Christmas Past From the Future
holden_caufield 12/5/2012 | 2:35:22 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Heard Tony might be leaving to join the illustrious Infinera team...

just a rumor -- but imagine...
Cybernetic_Ghost_Of_Chirstmas_ 12/5/2012 | 2:35:23 AM
re: Li Quits Procket
Thousands of years ago at the dawn of time there was a tarpit
known by the name Procket. The tarpit had a flaw in that it
was actually two types of tar that flowed together.
The "Proc" tar came from the sun and was full of bad ideas for
overly complex and expensive boards of hard wares. The "ket"
side came from the land of arrogance where the
Juniper trees grew.

The King of the tarpit came from the land of arrogance.
He thought that the juniper trees produced fruit that taisted
bad so he left to seek is fortune.

The king of the tarpit appointed a prince to oversee
the day-to-day operations of the pit. He was the smoking man.

The tarpit was a happy place during the dance of dollars,
but when the hard wares of the sun-apes failed to do what they promised,
the sun-apes were sent away. They had failed the
King.

A hundred years later, the dance of dollars ended nd a blood sacrifice
was needed to summon the dollars again. So the king killed the
smoking man and all his followers. But there
was a warning.
The smoking prince cursed the king that should he ever attempt to spill
blood again, he would lose his kingdom.

The king had already executed everyone else of importance in the kingdom.
There was nobody left to blame but the king
himself.

And so the king of the tarpit fell. He fell deep into the dark places
of the earth to plot his revenge.

I have seen this all in future.


So says:

The Cybernetic Ghost of Christmas Past from the Future
truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:35:24 AM
re: Li Quits Procket EOM
truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:35:24 AM
re: Li Quits Procket fw23

This is typical in a high tech startup going tho some rought times. The guy who wanted and or contributed to the most usually gets ousted by the suck up and VC and new management for fear of what he can do - Machiavelli.
fud9999 12/5/2012 | 2:35:25 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Dude, you sound like a 14 year fawning over a teen heartthrob. I don't recall seeing a 14 year old walking the halls at Procket!

As for Tony, smart guy, but needs to develop mature social and emotional skills. He quit, was quiting, might quit, 5 times I know of. Again very smart, but has a take my marbles and go home mindset when things don't go his way.

Best of Luck Tony,

Hank
fw23 12/5/2012 | 2:35:26 AM
re: Li Quits Procket You can see the suck-ups in procket already
starting to change their tune. But then again,
its easy now for everyone at procket who missed
a schedule or made bunches of mistakes to blame
Tony now.

fw23 12/5/2012 | 2:35:26 AM
re: Li Quits Procket
TONY AND PROCKET HAVE BEEN BETRAYED!!!!!

Procket was Tony's company and now a gang of
criminal losers has stolen it from him. This
is disguesting. How can this happen at the
most promising company around?!?!?

Does anyone know if there has been a mass
walkout yet? I would expect most of the
sharp people to take a walk after this OUTRAGE
against Tony.

Let that backstabbing LOSER from cisco and
all the rotten investors rot for this crime.

He is going to find out just like Randall did
that PROCKET is TONY. There is no PROCKET
without Tony!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

mattmiesnieks 12/5/2012 | 2:35:26 AM
re: Li Quits Procket AARNET is the Australinan Academic Research network. It's the network that primarily connets all the Universities in the country, and was the original "Internet" in Australia back in the dark ages

http://australianit.news.com.a...
wilecoyote 12/5/2012 | 2:35:27 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Nuff said. Primadonna of the highest order. Don't let the swingin' door hit you in the ass Tony.
ragnar 12/5/2012 | 2:35:28 AM
re: Li Quits Procket For real this time or another hissy fit where he takes his marbles and goes home for a few days..... only to return when everyone says they're sorry and he's real smart.
truelight 12/5/2012 | 2:35:28 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Perhaps a meeting of the minds - NOT. The fact that he has resigned and it is made public indicates to me at least that he wanted to make a statement to the industry that he was not happy with the progress of Procket. Anything else then it would be positoned as a mutual departing "Tony needs to do his own thing" blah blah.

TL
dljvjbsl 12/5/2012 | 2:35:30 AM
re: Li Quits Procket As we all know there are many different types of resignation. I wonder what kind of resignation this one was.
Photon_Got_Mad 12/5/2012 | 3:24:39 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Tony:

There is a question I want to seek some suggestions from you. Any way to get hold of you? any email, phone info?
optical_optimist 12/5/2012 | 3:24:39 AM
re: Li Quits Procket Photon_got_Mad:

You must have missed the Tony Li LR interview last year. Go to his personal web site ....

www.tony.li
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